The Hadith of the 12 Caliphs.

“As for those who divide their religion and break up into (sects), you have no part in them in the least: their affair is with Allah: He will, in the end, tell them the truth of all that they did.” (Qur’an, 6:159)

﷽ 

This idea of the Muslims following 12 Imams is a total concoction.

First and foremost, it has absolutely no support from the Qur’an.

We have more than established that here:

The Sunni Muslims the following hadith that the Shi’i will often use against them.

Narrated Jabir Ibn Samura:

I heard the Prophet (saw) saying, “There will be twelve commanders (Amir).” He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said the Prophet (saw) added, “All of them will be from Quraish.”

Source: (https://sunnah.com/bukhari:7222)

It has been narrated on the authority of Jabir b. Samura, who said:

I heard the Messenger of Allah (saw) say: Islam will continue to be triumphant until there have been twelve Caliphs. Then the Prophet (saw) said something which I could not understand. I asked my father: What did he say? He said: He has said that all of them (twelve Caliphs) will be from the Quraish.

Source: (https://sunnah.com/muslim:1821d)

It is actually quite easy-peasy lemon squeezy from a Sunni Muslim perspective to shut down Shi’i intrigue over these hadiths.

  1. None of these hadith say anything at all about the family of the Blessed Prophet (saw). So the wide-eyed speculation stops there.
  2. None of these hadith say anything at all about them ruling in succession. That is to say, one after the other.
  3. Did Hussein ibn Abi Talib ever rule over the Muslim ummah? We all know the answer to this is a resounding No! He didn’t rule over jack squat!


The reason we mention Hussein ibn Abi Talib is that the Shi’i who are quite imaginative see the succession of the Blessed Prophet (saw) as:

Ali ibn Abi Talib
Hasan ibn Ali
Husayn ibn Ali (Hussein ibn Abi Talib)
Ali ibn Husayn

So, from the perspective of a Sunni Muslim or an Ibadi Muslim, that’s a wrap. That means there is nothing more to discuss. Because the points that the Shi’i want to desperately prove from these hadiths cannot be established at all.

We will come back with our critique of this hadith. However, let us first look at the history of this number 12 prior to the advent of the Blessed Prophet Muhammed (saw).

THE NUMBER 12 HAS NO SIGNIFICANCE IN ISLAM.

The number 12 is not significant or important, in any shape or form, in Islam. It is the atomic number of atoms in Magnesium. 12 is the number of zodiac characters in both the Western and Chinese models. There are 12 months in a year of the Gregorian calendar. The 12th surah in the Qur’an is called ‘Yusuf’ or Joseph.

The 12th chapter and 12th verse of the Qur’an say the following:

“Send him with us tomorrow to enjoy himself and play, and we shall take every care of him.” (Qur’an 12:12)

“Surely, the number of months with Allah is twelve months in Allah’s ordinance since the day when He created the heavens and the earth, of these four being sacred.” (Qur’an 9:36)

Nothing here is analogous to 12 Imams. The verse says of the 12 months, 4 of them are sacred.

Are the Shi’i going to tell us that of the 12 Imams only four of them are sacred?

This holds no significance to 12 tribes, 12 disciples or 12 imams, or 12 rulers at all.

12 relates to Israel, and the tribes. It has absolutely nothing to do with Islam.

THE NUMBER 12 AND THE TRIBES OF ISRAEL

Let us look at Israel (Jacob) and the 12 tribes in the Qur’an and in the Bible.

“Allah made a covenant of old with the Children of Israel and We raised among them twelve chieftains, and Allah said: Lo! I am with you. If ye establish worship and pay the poor-due, and believe in My messengers and support them, and lend unto Allah a kindly loan, surely I shall remit your sins, and surely I shall bring you into Gardens underneath which rivers flow. Whoso among you disbelieves after this will go astray from a plain road.” (Qur’an 5:12)

“Moreover, We divided them into twelve tribes And when his people asked Moses for water, We inspired him, “Strike the rock with your staff!” -after which twelve springs gushed forth from it so that all the people knew whence to drink., And We caused the clouds to comfort them with their shade, and We sent down unto them manna and quails, [saying:] “Partake of the good things which We have provided for you as sustenance.” And [by all their sinning] they did no harm unto Us-but [only] against their own selves did they sin.” (Qur’an 7:160)

“So We dispersed them as separate communities all over the earth; some of them were righteous, and some of them less than that: and the latter We tried with blessings as well as with afflictions so that they might mend their ways.” (Qur’an 7:168)

“Say (O Muslims): We believe in Allah and that which is revealed unto us and that which was revealed unto Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the tribes, and that which Moses and Jesus received, and that which the prophets received from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and unto Him, we have surrendered.” (Qur’an 2:136)

“Nay! do you say that Abraham and Ismail and Jacob and the tribes were Jews or Christians? Say: Are you better knowing or Allah? And who is more unjust than he who conceals a testimony that he has from Allah? And Allah is not at all heedless of what you do.” (Qur’an 2:140)

“Truly We gave unto Moses nine tokens, clear proofs (of Allah’s Sovereignty). Do but ask the Children of Israel how he came unto them, then Pharaoh said unto him: Lo! I deem you one bewitched, O Moses.” (Qur’an 7:101)

Why were 9 tokens given? Why weren’t 12 tokens given? Why weren’t 7 tokens given?

“Say: We believe in Allah and what has been revealed to us, and what was revealed to Abraham and Ismail and Ishaq and Jacob and the tribes, and what was given to Musa and Isa and to the prophets from their Lord; we do not make any distinction between any of them, and to Him do we submit. ” (Qur’an 3:84)

“Lo! Thus spoke Joseph unto his father: “O my father! Behold, I saw [in a dream] eleven stars, as well as the sun and the moon: I saw them prostrate themselves before me!” (Qur’an 12:6)


Here Joseph mentions 11 stars and, altogether, 13 celestial bodies. No mention of anything 12 here.

There is absolutely nothing in the entirety of the Qur’an that would assign or even remotely hint that the 12 sons of Israel (Jacob) played any role that the 12er Shi’i designates for their 12 Imams. Nothing analogous here at all.

Now, what does the Bible say about these 12 sons of Jacob/Israel?

While Israel was living in that region, Reuben went in and slept with his father’s concubine Bilhah, and Israel heard of it. Jacob had twelve sons:

The sons of Leah:

Reuben, the firstborn of Jacob,

Simeon, Levi, Judah, Issachar and Zebulun.

The sons of Rachel:

Joseph and Benjamin.

The sons of Rachel’s servant Bilhah:

Dan and Naphtali.

The sons of Leah’s servant Zilpah:

Gad and Asher.

These were the sons of Jacob, who were born to him in Paddan Aram.

Source: (Genesis 35:22-26)

“All these are the twelve tribes of Israel, and this is what their father said to them when he blessed them, giving each the blessing appropriate to him.” (Genesis 49:28)

There is absolutely nothing in the entirety of the Bible that would assign or even remotely hint that the 12 sons of Israel (Jacob) played any role that the 12er Shi’i designate for their 12 Imams.

Were the 12 Imams the names of 12 tribes? Did the descendants of these Imams fight each other in a bitter civil war as was the case with Judah and Benjamin against the other 10 tribes? We all know that the answer to all of this is a resounding No! Nothing analogous here at all.

The tribes descended from the twelve sons of Jacob. They all existed alive simultaneously as separate people. According to the Imami Shi’i, was there any point in history in which their 12 imams existed simultaneously as separate people? We all know that the answer to all of this is a resounding No! Nothing analogous here at all.

  1. Reuben
  2. Simeon
  3. Levi
  4. Judah
  5. Issachar
  6. Zebulun
  7. Dan
  8. Naphtali
  9. Gad
  10. Asher
  11. Joseph
  12. Benjamin

NUMBER 12 AND THE DISCIPLES OF JESUS.

Jesus had 12 disciples because they were to go to each of the 12 tribes of Israel as previously mentioned. That’s it.

Now let us turn our attention to the disciples of Christ Jesus (as), as they are mentioned in the Qur’an.

“When Jesus found Unbelief on their part He said: “Who will be My helpers to (the work of) Allah?” Said the disciples: “We are Allah’s helpers: We believe in Allah, and do bear witness that we are Muslims.” (Qur’an 3:50)

“And behold! I inspired the disciples to have faith in Me and Mine Messenger: they said, ‘We have faith, and do you bear witness that we bow to Allah as Muslims'”. (Quran 5:111)

“O you who believe! Be Allah’s helpers, even as Jesus son of Mary said unto the disciples: Who are my helpers for Allah? They said: We are Allah’s helpers. And a party of the Children of Israel believed while a party disbelieved. Then We strengthened those who believed against their foe, and they became the uppermost.” (Qur’an 61:14)

There is absolutely no mention of the number of disciples anywhere in the Qur’an, which is both telling and interesting.

Now let us turn our attention to the disciples of Jesus (a.s) as they are mentioned in the New Testament.

“The names of the twelve apostles are these: first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother; Philip and Bartholomew; Thomas and Matthew the tax collector; James the son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus; Simon the Zealot, and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed Jesus.” (Matthew 10: 2-4)

“Jesus said to them, “Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.” (Matthew 19:28)

These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: “Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel.” (Matthew 10:6)

“It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates. On the gates were written the names of the twelve tribes of Israel.(Revelation 21:12)

The Twelve Disciples (Apostles)

  1. Peter the Apostle (Simon Peter)
  2. Andrew the Apostle (Peter’s brother)
  3. James the Great
  4. John the Apostle
  5. Philip the Apostle
  6. Bartholomew the Apostle
  7. Thomas the Apostle
  8. Matthew the Apostle
  9. James son of Alphaeus
  10. Thaddeus
  11. Simon the Zealot
  12. Judas Iscariot

Replacement after Judas

After the betrayal and death of Judas Iscariot, the remaining apostles selected:

  • Matthias the Apostle

We have no record anywhere of the 12 sons of Jacob or the 12 disciples of Jesus giving legal verdicts, and so forth to anyone.

Not only that but the analogy creates real problems for the 12er Shi’i concept because the 12 sons of Jacob and the 12 disciples of Jesus were concurrent (not in succession).

Not only that, but one of the 12 disciples of Jesus was a traitor.

So, if this is analogous to the 12er Shi’i do tell us which of the “12 imams” was a traitor to Rasul Allah (saw)?

In fact, the 12er Shi’i seem to catch the unsuspecting Sunni Muslims with something that they may be remotely familiar with or something that seems vague.

“You remember about the 12 tribes of Israel?” “Oh yeah,” says the Sunni layman. “You remember Jesus had 12 disciples?” “Hmm, sounds right”, says the unsure Sunni Muslim who has never bothered to look into these matters.

So, after they “establish” something murky about the number 12 being significant, then they come and put their spin on the ahadith from Bukhari and Muslim about 12 rulers, and so forth. Even then, as we saw, those hadiths did not even allow the Shi’i to put their spin on the aware Sunni Muslim.

Now, note that these 12 disciples of Jesus, according to the above text, were with him concurrently, not in succession. None of these disciples ever disappeared, waiting until the present. One of these disciples betrayed Jesus. Which of the “12 Imams” betrayed Rasul Allah (saw)?

Also, you will note that these 12 disciples were to go unto the 12 tribes of Israel (Jacob). The whole of the New Testament is about Jesus (The Messiah) coming for his people, not the whole wide world. That is why you have the names of the 12 tribes of Israel at the gates of heaven in the vision.

Are these 12 Shi’i Imams going to have their names on 12 gates for 12 tribes of Arabs (only) numbering 12,000 each?

The only thing analogous between the 12 Imams and the 12 disciples of Jesus, who were sent to the 12 descendant tribes of Jacob, is in fact the number 12. That is all.

We have clearly pulled the rug out of the 12er Shi’i idea of there being anything analogous here.


Unfortunately, our respected Imams of Hadith were not infallible in their collection of Hadith. They allowed a bizarre narration about 12 leaders to slip in their corpus.

The 12er Shi’i then use that hadith to persuade Sunni Muslims to their perspective.

Mohammed Hashim Kamali explains the situation best.

“Hadith critics have expressed reservations. Nevertheless, over the authenticity of various hadiths. Some politically tendentious hadith have come under criticism. One such hadith that al-Bukhari has recorded on the authority of Jabir b Samura is as follows:

“I heard the Prophet, peace be on him, saying that ‘there will be twelve rulers (amiran), ‘ and then the Prophet uttered words which I did not hear-but my father believed they were ‘…all of them will be from Quraysh’. “

“The Shi’i scholars have taken this hadith as “decisive evidence”, on the veracity of their belief in the twelve Imams. The Sunnis themselves have advanced different interpretations of this hadith. One interpreter thus understood this to mean that the twelve amirs will be simultaneous, all to whom will be laying claim to leadership, and the context is, therefore, one of tumult (al-fitna). “


“The various versions of probably this same hadith that Muslim and Abu Dawud have recorded say something different. Briefly, Muslim recorded a hadith to the effect that “this matter (i.e the Caliphate) will not go away until twelve Caliphs have come and gone.” Abu Dawud similarly recorded a hadith to the effect that “this religion shall remain until twelve Caliphs have ruled, all of them with the agreement and support of the umma.”

“The commentator of al-Bukhari, Ibn Hajar al-‘Asqalani, has quoted these views, and reading all of them together, he thought that the reference in that respect was to the Caliphate. But this only added to complication in view of the common knowledge that the approved Caliphs were only four, not twelve, According to Qadi ‘Iyad Al-Yahsubi the hadith “probably meant just leaders (‘a’immat al’adl) of whom four have lived and the rest may emerge any time before the day of resurrection.” This was “just the right sort of interpretation,” according to Jawad Yasin, for its Shi’i readers with which to vindicate their belief in occultation and the return of their twelfth Imam any time before the day of resurrection.”

“Ibn al -Jawzi surmised the meaning of the hadith at issue and commented that the Prophet had probably meant twelve rulers, excluding his companions. It was then suggested that the hadith had referred to the Umayyad Caliphs. The problem here was that the Umayyad Caliphs, starting from Mu’awiya (d. 41 H) to Marwan al-Thani (d. 127 H) numbered fourteen, not twelve. Ibn al-Jawzi’s response to this was that Mu’awiya may be excluded since he was a Companion. Then he added that Marwan Ibn al-Hakam (d. 65 H) should also be excluded as he was a usurper and took office after the people had elected ‘Abd Allah b al-Zubayr. This rather imaginative interpretation fitted in with the counting of the Umayyad Caliphs at twelve and the image that was consequently conveyed of them was that they were leaders who ruled with the support of the umma.”

“This interpretation was based on several questionable assumptions, one of which excluded the first four Caliphs from the counting altogether, then it was assumed that Mu’awiya as not a usurper of political power; that Marwan b. al-Hakam was not to be counted as a Caliph, and that ‘Abd Allah b al-Zubayr had been conclusively elected to be the Caliph.”


“All of these rather weak interpretations were attempted with the pious yet questionable motive of upholding the reliability of the leading hadith collections and also to lend support perhaps to the Umayyad rule. The episode sustained itself simply because the chain of transmitters of the hadith in question appeared sound. Al-Bukhari and Muslim evidently recorded it because of its isnad without paying much attention to its meaning. And then a series of apologetic commentaries followed suit to justify what they had done.”

“If the true purpose of all hadith is to clarify and interpret the Qur’an and those aspects of Islam that can properly be said to be a necessary part of its belief structure and its Shari’a, then the hadith we have just reviewed is so peripheral that it hardly merits all the speculative effort that is undertaken to justify it.”

Source: (A Textbook of Hadith Studies, pages 206-208 by Mohammed Hashim Kamali)

However, all this fuss is over nothing. As we have shown it is too easy to refute the Shi’i claims in regard to the above hadith.

Critique of the matn (text) of the hadith.

Narrated Jabir Ibn Samura:

“I heard the Prophet saying, “There will be twelve commanders (Amir).” He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said the Prophet added, “All of them will be from Quraish.”

Source😦https://sunnah.com/bukhari:7222)

It has been narrated on the authority of Jabir b. Samura, who said:

I heard the Messenger of Allah (saw) say: Islam will continue to be triumphant until there have been twelve Caliphs. Then the Prophet (saw) said something which I could not understand. I asked my father: What did he say? He said: He has said that all of them (twelve Caliphs) will be from the Quraish.

Source: (https://sunnah.com/muslim:1821d)

Prima Qur’an Comments:

Our critique of this hadith will not focus so much on the chain of narration as it will focus on the text itself, but rather using aql and mantiq.

Is it not odd that Jabir Ibn Samura is to have related something of purportedly such importance to the Messenger of Allah (saw) and yet, did not catch all of it so that his father (or the man standing next to him) had to be the one to inform him of the missing bits?

Why is Jabir Ibn Samura the only one narrating this? He was possibly only 10 years of age at the time.

Why is no clarification sought? The companions are known to ask the Blessed Messenger (saw) about the most minute details of his blessed life. Why is there no clarification sought on a matter of purportedly such weight?

If the Blessed Prophet Muhammed (saw) narrated about the future, why not simply mention Abu Bakr, or Ali as his successor?

What if the missing bits were as follows:

“I heard the Prophet saying, “There will be twelve commanders (Amir).” He then said they would all be corrupt and vile. My father, said the Prophet added, “All of them will be from Quraish.”

It does seem odd that the Blessed Messenger (saw) would foretell about 12 rulers and yet not state plainly that Abu Bakr, or Ali, was to be the successor?

The Shi’i have yet to produce a single hadith where the Blessed Messenger (saw) explicitly stated in no uncertain terms that Ali would be the Amir of the Muslims, after his death. Not one!

We know you might be thinking about the incident at Ghadir Khum. Don’t worry, we have you covered.

Look at this map of the umayyad dynasty. That is quite an accomplishment for an empire that did not put the familiy of the Blessed Prophet (saw) at the centre of thier doctrine!

You may read about that here:

Lastly, among the Imami Shi’i they still cannot agree upon which list of 12 one is to follow.

You can read about that here:

You may also be interested to read the following:

May Allah (swt) Guide the Ummah.

May Allah (swt) Forgive the Ummah.

 

21 Comments

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21 responses to “The Hadith of the 12 Caliphs.

  1. Ammar's avatar Ammar

    Salams brother,

    This is an interesting analysis. But if we are to be sure of the falsity of the 12 Imams, we should look at who these Imams are, what is their relationship with the prophet, what is their contributions towards Islam, are any of their duas and matched by any other human beings to this date?

    Following this what are the ayaats that they put forward to supporting their perspective?

    If what you’re saying is that, based on one or a few persons , who you claimed is from the Shia of Ali, contributed to the twelve successor Hadith and he was trying to influence people with contributing such Hadith, how certain are you that, that was his intention and he was not just relating it because he heard it from the Prophet?

    There are many more things to consider before you can conclude as you did.
    What was the position of Prophet’s family? Are there verses in the Quran talking bout this? Verses such as mawaddah fil Qurba(42:23), verses on Mubahila, verses surrounding the Event of Ghadeer? All this would play an important part in your analysis.

    Why the Prophet’s(s.a.w.a) family? Essentially because the 12 Imams are the prophet’s (s.a.w.a) descendants. And hence you need to find evidence against them being Imams.

    I hope you can further your research when you’re free.

    Wsalams. Fi Aminillah

    • Walakum salaam

      “But if we are to be sure of the falsity of the 12 Imams, we should look at who these Imams are, what is their relationship with the prophet, what is their contributions towards Islam, are any of their duas and matched by any other human beings to this date?”

      Absolutely not. We have no basis in the Holy Qur’an for any of this; not only this but the Zaidi Shi’i have managed just fine without them. We don’t need to have some belief and then superimpose it upon the Holy Qur’an.

      “Following this what are the ayaats that they put forward to supporting their perspective?
      If what you’re saying is that, based on one or a few persons , who you claimed is from the Shia of Ali, contributed to the twelve successor Hadith and he was trying to influence people with contributing such Hadith, how certain are you that, that was his intention and he was not just relating it because he heard it from the Prophet?”

      Well, that is a good question. What we are looking at is precedent for such a belief. We know for example there is precedent for a belief in the coming of a Messiah figure as Jews believe this. We know there is precedent for belief in the second coming of Christ Jesus as Christians believe this. Yet we have shown conclusively that any literature (hadith in particular) anywhere from the 12er Shi’a in no way, shape, or form aligns with anything from the 12 tribes of Jacob or the 12 disciples of Jesus.

      If we deal with the idea itself of these 12 Imams upon whom which Ali is to be the first, what the 12er present us with is a negligent Imam (namely Ali) who sat back and watch as the Muslims were ruled by two ‘imposters’ not having the slightest of faith that Allah (swt) would come to his aid. It presents him in a most disparaging light. Or, at best he is presented as an opportunist having leadership thrusted upon him during a time of upheaval. We will have the time to examine the actions of Ali in another post,insh’Allah.

      “How certain are you that, that was his intention and he was not just relating it because he heard it from the Prophet (saw).”

      Hence why I said that we need to have a close look at these chains of narrations and juxtapose them together and look at the narrators.

      And in the event that it were authentic, as shown from above the Sunni interpretation become’s very plausible considering that in the past any time there was 12 anything, tribes, disciples, they were concurrent.

      We also look to see how other groups such as Zaydi Shi’a interact with this material.

      “There are many more things to consider before you can conclude as you did.”

      I am quite sure that the 12ER SHIA have a great many things for us to chase after.
      What this article has done is prove conclusively that there is no precedent in any way, shape, or form from the 12 tribes of Jacob or the 12 disciples of Jesus that has anything to do with 12 Imams. What we did show is that all of those would be narrations that come from the 12er shi’a that would suggest such have no historical reality. Someone saw the number 12 and just went wild.

      “What was the position of Prophet’s family? Are there verses in the Quran talking bout this? Verses such as mawaddah fil Qurba(42:23), verses on Mubahila, verses surrounding the Event of Ghadeer? All this would play an important part in your analysis.
      Why the Prophet’s(s.a.w.a) family? Essentially because the 12 Imams are the prophet’s (s.a.w.a) descendants. And hence you need to find evidence against them being Imams.
      I hope you can further your research when you’re free.”

      Let us take a look at the Holy Qur’an 42:23
      “That is (the Bounty) whereof Allah gives Glad Tidings to His Servants who believe and do righteous deeds. Say: “No reward do I ask of you for this except the love of those near of kin.” And if any one earns any good, We shall give him an increase of good in respect thereof: for Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Ready to appreciate (service)…”

      To mention this because in the Arabic text we hear “HASANatan nazid lahu feeha HUSNAIN husnaninna Allaha ghafoorun shakoor” really comes across as both desperate, and imaginative.

      We know that what we consider an Arabic name, Jameela, Layla, Ahmed has a meaning. So using a text like this and trying to superimpose upon this text a reference to two future Imams only bolsters the claim of this article.

      I thought Christian’s pouring over the Old Testament to find any vague reference and apply it to Christ Jesus was stretched and imaginative while doing so with verses like this rivals even that to be frank.

      “Essentially because the 12 Imams are the prophet’s (s.a.w.a) descendants. And hence you need to find evidence against them being Imams.”

      I have to do no such thing. Why would I have to find evidence against anyone being an Imam? If Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was claimed to be an Imam by his followers why would I need to dispute this? All I would need to do is to look at his claims.

      One thing about Prima-Qur’an is you will find Shi’a who will come here happy to see the claims of the Sunni Muslims challenged. Yet, when we have articles on apostasy and stoning to death that crush the ijtihad of these “infallible” Imams we don’t expect the Shi’a to be in glee.

      “But the people divided their religion among them into sects – each faction, in what it has, rejoicing. (Holy Quran 23:53)

      This is what we find isn’t it? That the Shi’a will come to Prima-Qur’an with no thought of the goal and intention of Prima-Qur’an they only want to see what articles they can possibly use against the Sunni.

      Yet, with the many Shi’a I am sure have read this site not one has dared to venture to counter the claims that the Holy Qur’an does not support death for apostasy nor stoning for adultery.

      Fi Aminillah brother.

  2. zindabadpak's avatar zindabadpak

    Hello Brother Assalam o alaikum brother I want to know about Ibadi view on battle of Karabala please tell me about Karbala brother

  3. zindabadpak's avatar zindabadpak

    brother what is Ibadi view on best of person after the noble prophets of God.

  4. zindabadpak's avatar zindabadpak

    And the Hadith which states that Hasan and Hussain(RA) will be the leaders of young men in heaven is true according to Ibadi school of thought and the hadith which states that Mariym(RA),Fatima(RA),Khadija(RA)and Asiya(RA) will be the leader of women in paradise is true or not?

  5. omerh's avatar omerh

    “The 12 imams narrations all come from a limited group of people (around 10) who are all connected through direct student teacher relationships, and all studied in Qum and Baȝdād. The narrations start from ʿAlī ibn ʾIbrāhīm al-Qummī, and his student al-Kulaynī, and are then also narrated by al-Kulaynī’s student an-Nuʿmānī and ʿAlī ibn ʾIbrāhīm’s son aṣ-Ṣadūq. It then goes to the student of aṣ-Ṣadūq, al-Xazzāz al-Qummī, in addition to his teacher Ibn ʿAyyāš, and then to aš-Šayx aṭ-Ṭūsī the student of al-Mufīd and aš-Šarīf al-Murtaλ̣ā (the students of aṣ-Ṣadūq), then to aṭ-Ṭūsī’s student of aṭ-Ṭabrasī. There is no reason why such a group of closely connected people, not even being an especially large group, would be precluded from the possibility of agreeing on a lie. Furthermore, the vast majority of these narrations go through the ʾimāms themselves, specifically the ʾimāms after al-Ħusayn رضي الله عنه, and the amount of authors narrating the ones that go through other than them do not even reach 5 people. Almost none, if any of the narrations that do not go through any of these ʾimāms are even reliable by Twelver standards, making it impossible for this to be mutawātir. As for the narrations of appointment from one ʾimām to the next, then for many of them, such as as-Sajjād and al-Jawād, these narrations are very few in number, and nowhere near tawātur.

    It is known by tawātur that the companions of the 12 ʾimāms often had significant disputes and confusion over who the next ʾimām would be. If there were a mutawātir explicit designation for the 12 ʾimāms, or even from one ʾimām to the next, then it would have been inconceivable that these disputes and confusion would have occurred, and those companions would not have had to use other methods to try to figure out who the next ʾimām would be. A Zaydī scholar was able to compile 100 different narrations in Twelver books of the companions of the ʾimāms being unaware of who the next ʾimām would be.”

    Excerpt from: docs.google.com/document/u/1/d/1WvyoPZMvn97I3fACf9czof7Ki3bSM0s-wQQsskFX8UQ/

    also see:

    http://www.twelvershia.net/2019/04/08/imams-of-the-gaps/

    &

    http://www.twelvershia.net/2017/01/07/identifying-infallible-imam/

    and for Arabs see the series by. سيد مازن سلسلة رواية تنسف خرافة تنصيب. اثني عشر

    bonus points:

    The hadith says 12 caliphs not 12 prophets

    Shias don’t accept Ahad for Aqeedah. This hadeeth is only narrated by 2 so it is definitely not good enough.

    We don’t even have to name them. The prophet didn’t name them so why should we. I bet shias can’t name all 313 that will help the Mehdi

    see the most authentic shia hadith naming the 12 imams: http://youtube.com/post/UgkxQq_dThoedgPfKxM9VsviQDgvgulo5f9R

    There will be 12 mehdis after the mehdi himself

    u should ask the shias who are the twelve after the mehdi if they are opposing the same question to you

    r/ByShiasForNonShias - Debunking the 12 Caliphs Hadith
  6. i just learned that the 12th chieftain of bani Israel was a dajjal and that there is a 12 hypocrites hadith

    also here is a beautiful quote from their scholars that is enough to refute their number games:

    Al-Marjiʿ Āyat Allāh Muḥammad Saʿīd al-Ṭabāṭabāʾī al-Ḥakīm states:

    The proof (ḥujjah) must be clear regarding the points of contention that divide the ummah.

    If these points of contention are of such importance in religion, then the proof concerning them must be evident and manifest in a way that leaves no room for excuse or ijtihād (independent reasoning).

    Rather, deviating from it must stem from either deliberate opposition and obstinate defiance or from blind misguidance that clouds perception, combined with negligence in seeking the truth and recognizing it—whether due to blind imitation (taqlīd), fanaticism (taʿaṣṣub), or similar causes that do not serve as valid excuses before Allāh, the Most High.

    As Allāh says:

    “Indeed, We have destined for Hell many of the jinn and mankind; they have hearts with which they do not understand, eyes with which they do not see, and ears with which they do not hear. They are like cattle—rather, they are even more astray. It is they who are the heedless.” (Al-Aʿrāf 7:179)

    The Necessity of a Clear Proof

    The reason why the proof must be clear is that one of the primary objectives of prophethood (nubuwwah) is to establish sufficient evidence for the paths of guidance (hudā) and faith (īmān), upon which salvation from Hell and success in Paradise depend.

    “So that mankind will have no argument against Allāh after the messengers.” (Al-Nisāʾ 4:165)

    As Allāh, the Almighty, also says:

    “And Allāh would not misguide a people after He had guided them, until He made clear to them what they should avoid. Indeed, Allāh has full knowledge of everything.” (Al-Tawbah 9:115)

    Numerous verses of the Qurʾān and prophetic traditions (aḥādīth) affirm this principle.

    The Justice and Generosity of Allāh

    Moreover, the matter is even more evident: Allāh, the Most Just (aʿdal) and Most Generous (akram), would never cast His servants into Hell without a clear proof that removes ignorance, eliminates excuses, and leaves no room for doubt, conjecture, or ijtihād**.**

    This necessitates that points of contention that ultimately lead to the division of the ummah—which serve as the criteria for salvation from eternal destruction—must be so clear and manifest that the only reasons for deviation from them would be either deliberate opposition and obstinacy or blind misguidance that offers no valid excuse.

    There should be no room for them to be subject to justifiable ijtihād that could excuse one who errs.

    [Uṣūl al-Dīn, pgs. 212-214]

  7. ابو بكر الصديق is 12 letters 😂

  8. i was reading your response.

    I have a great analogy for the hsanatan husna:

    Asma is mentioned in the Quran إِنْ هِىَ إِلَّآ أَسْمَآءٌۭ

    وَسَبِّحْ بِٱلعشىِّ وَٱلْإِبْكَـرAbuBakr and Aisha are also mentioned in the Quran

    Even Yazeed is mentioned in the Quran

    ‎وَيَزِيدُ ٱللَّهُ ٱلَّذِينَ ٱهْتَدَوْا۟

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