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EF Dawah Discussion with Josh (Jewish) | Is the Quran Being Uncreated Against Tawheed?

“Indeed, We have made it an Arabic Qur’an that you might understand.” (Qur’an 43:3)

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We never met this beautiful soul, Joshua. May Allah guide him! He is a very intelligent man. This makes sense. We have a feeling that he is keen on Islam. However, just as he is aware that Judaism has various debates on various issues, he is also smart enough to know that the house of Islam, unfortunately, is not one big happy family.

Probing positions and views before deciding to commit to something IS an intelligent thing to do!

This man, Joshua, had Ali Dawah on the ropes when they were discussing the issue of whether Allah (swt) rested. Because, using a consistent approach, Ali Dawah began to realize he had no scope to argue with the forceful position of this young man. To Ali Dawah’s credit, he didn’t force the issue.

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/does-allah-rest-or-does-allah-settle-or-sit-on-the-throne-judaism-and-the-athari-creed/

Now to this topic: Discussion with Josh (Jewish) | Is the Quran Being Uncreated Against Tawheed?

Abbas: “I don’t think it was its attribute. We, we’ve, I think we’ve answered the question many times that, with the knowledge of Allah, the Qur’an would have existed eternally. See. The actual physical book the mushaaf that was sent down and this is obviously an English translation, but the actual Arabic text when it was written down it is something that once it gets old it’s even burnt or it’s buried or whatever. To dispose of it in a respectful way.”


Abbas: “Burning it is actually not disrespectful in Islam. It’s a valid way of getting rid of an old manuscript that’s damaged and can’t be read, so you would have to have a new copy or whatever and the old one would be respectfully ah sort of ah, you know, gone away with in that way. But the knowledge of Allah, as a Jew, umm I think that you would accept that whatever knowledge Allah has, for example, the Torah itself. Would you say that the Torah itself is something that came into existence or did God have that in his knowledge but bring it into existence when he chose to?

Josh: “So I believe that the Torah was in fact created. Only God himself is uncreated. But everything within the so-called “knowledge” of God is created at some point.”

Abbas: “Right, so then are you saying that there was a time when God did not know of the Torah?”

Joshua: “No, there was not a “time” before it, because God is above time. So God created time. Rather or not God created the Torah before he created time is not something I know.“

Abbas: “So, basically what were saying is that was there ever a moment when God did not know of the Torah?”

Joshua.” In a sense, yes. Prior to the creation of the Torah, there could be no knowledge of the Torah.”

Abbas: “So there was a moment when God had no knowledge of the Torah. (Now there is a moment there where the video does a flash sequence. I do not know if that means the video was edited or that is just a video effect.)”

Joshua: “Yes.”

Hamza: “So you don’t believe God has all full knowledge.”

Joshua, “No because, because knowledge we believe is an attribute of God. God’s omniscience is an attribute of him. Therefore, he created his own omniscience.”

Abbas: “Josh, is that a mainstream Jewish belief? In terms of actual rabbinical grounding. That the Torah, at one point God did not actually know what he was going to say. What God was going to give to Moses.”

Hamza (interrupts): “Josh, do you believe that God knows the future?”

Josh: “Yes, because there is no future when it comes to God. Cause for God all time, past, present and future” (could make out due to Hamza speaking over).

Hamza: “So then God knows what the Torah isn’t it always?”

(The team got Josh to admit they had a point that there could be no ‘before’ as he (Joshua) just admitted that past/present/future….)

Imran: (The best listener out of the bunch, in our opinion) He pivots back to the original question: “Your question was really an interesting one because you, you raised this as a question about Tawhid. And you said that this is uh, it requires an explanation having the Qur’an as an uncreated statement that the Qur’an is uncreated, and then you have Allah, who is eternal. Does it affect Tawhid in any way? That was really underlying thing that I think you were trying to get to. So I am going to give you an analogy. Now, obviously, all analogies are imperfect, and we can’t perfect analogies, particularly when it comes to the Creator. But I am gonna try and give an analogy to drawn on and explain. So you’re speaking, right Josh?”

Josh: “Yes.”

Imran: “Can your speech exist without you?” (Can you exist without speaking)

Josh: “I don’t know. Can my speech. Theoretically there could be my speech without me. I suppose. I’m not sure though.”

Imran: “I would say that that’s clearly, that clearly the answer to that question is No. Um, I don’t know how your thinking…if you did not exist, could your speech exist?”

Josh: “Depends. If my speech has to, if there’s prerequisite to the existence of my speech is the existence of myself.”

Imran: “Sorry, sorry to interrupt you. Your thinking. I don’t understand your thinking process. What you’re doing is your taking this speech and your giving it attributes. Now we agreed that speech is an attribute of the Creator. We’ve agreed this. Like just as speech manifests from you. Now the question is do the attributes exist on their own or not?”

Joshua: “With regard to attributes of myself or attributes of God?”

Imran: “So the analogy is to get you to think about the Creator. I am trying to use yourself as an example just to try and give that. So, for example is: Can your speech exist without you?”

Joshua: “So if we (God forbid) leave God out of this picture for this particular analogy. Um, otherwise it’s going to get far too complicated. Then for sure, then you would be right that my speech could not exist without me.”

Imran: “So now I’m going to say now let’s talk about the Creator. Now I’m going to say the attributes of the Creator can’t exist without the Creator.”

Joshua: “Yes, that’s true.”

Imran: “Yup, so now we don’t have a conflation between were not comparing two different things. The Qur’an is the speech of Allah. It’s an attribute you understand? So now the question comes. When we’re talking about (holds up the Qur’an) the text, do we/are we referring to that attribute or not? So there’s two things and now we have to differentiate this. The attribute we’ve agreed is eternal. Why? Because the Creator is eternal, the attribute is eternal. Therefore, the Qur’an is uncreated and eternal. So now that’s a dealt with thing. This is a (holding up the Qur’an) a creation, like somebody has put these pages together, written the pages and the ink down. This (holding up the Qur’an) is not that attribute.”

Joshua: “I understand the difference between the written Qur’an and the spoken Qur’an that..” (unintelligible as Imran talked over him.)

Imran: “So that means coming to the concept of Tawhid. It doesn’t impact that at all. Another example would be: Creation. One of the attributes of God is that he is the Creator. Now, (we agree with this yeah?) “

Joshua: “Yes.”

Imran: “So the creative command is not separate from the creator in any sense, right?”

Joshua: “I would disagree with that because, prior to because prior to having created anything, how can God be considered to be a Creator? In order to be a Creator you need to have a creation.”

Imran: “So o.k that’s interesting, so I think that you sorry Hamza, you wanna…”

Hamza: “You don’t need to create to have the attribute of a creator you just need to create to demonstrate the attribute.“

Joshua: “But that depends on how we understand what the attribute is. Um so, let me just think about how to explain.”

Hamza: (getting visibly impatient) “Oh o.k before Allah, before God created the universe, you believe God created the universe?”

Joshua: “Yes.”

Hamza: “Did he have the attribute of Creator?”

Joshua: “Before he created anything he did not….”

Hamza: “Did he have the attribute of Creator?”

Joshua: “No.”

Hamza: (Surprised) “No!? How did he create than?”

Imran: “O.K. Let’s change the word for a moment, Josh. Let’s make the word ability.”

Joshua: “Ability? o.k. Did God have the ability to create? Yes.”

Imran: “O.K so that’s the attribute.”

Hamza: “That’s the attribute.”

Joshua: “Oh that’s what you mean when you say attributes.”

Hamza: “The Creation is the manifestation of the attribute. Evidence of the attribute if you like.”

Joshua: “It’s the manifestation of ‘Ah’..” (light bulb moment).

Comments:

Over all, that was a very good exchange. In reality, the question Joshua poses is two-fold in nature.

  1. Is the Qur’an created or eternal?
  2. If it is created or eternal, does this pose a problem for the doctrine of Tawhid?

The first argument brought by Abbas is not a good argument.

The eternity of knowledge does not imply the eternity of the known. Otherwise, all things that have come into being would be eternal! Imagine saying, because Allah (swt) has eternal knowledge about Christ Jesus, that Christ Jesus would be eternal! Christians would just love that!

Imran seemed the more learned of the three, at least in terms of Sunni theology. He got straight to the point. However, Imran did a very clever cart before the horse when he asked:

Can your speech exist without you? Actually, we could ask: (Can you exist without speaking?)

The answer to that is yes. You can exist without speaking.

We affirm the attribute of “speech” for Allah (swt) as Imam Diya al-Din ‘Abd al-Aziza Thamini (raheemullah), says in his Mu’alim:

“Know that speech is sometimes referred to Allah in the meaning of negating dumbness of Him, and it then is to be understood as an essential attribute in the way of such attributes. And sometimes it is referred to Him in the sense of its being one of His actions, and it is then to be understood as such. So the meaning of His being Speaking, according to the first interpretation, is that He is not dumb; and according to the second that He is a Creator of Speech.”

Source: (Ma’alim al-din (Oman: Wizarat al-Turath al-Qawmi wa l-Thaqafah, 1st edition 2:9.)

Now this is where it gets a bit tricky for Sunni theology.

Imran: “So the creative command is not separate from the creator in any sense, right?”

Response: What do you actually mean by the creator and his attributes? Because the Sunni theological position is that the attributes of Allah (swt) are not equal to Allah (swt) nor other than his essence!

This is a very, very BIG problem for Sunni theology.

Questions for the Athari/Salafi school.

So, if the attributes are not identical to the essence or other than the essence, what are they?

Can you prove your claims that the attributes are not identical to the essence using kitab wa sunnah?

Using the Qur’an and the Sunnah?

Will you need to rely upon kalam?

Actually, a VERY GOOD QUESTION FOR ANY SUNNI MUSLIM IS:

What do you mean when you say God is one?’

This may come as a surprise to the readers. They may say the being is one, but can they really, since they also have these attributes that have a quasi/pseudo-being status, in that they are not equal to the being nor other than it?

The second point from Imran

Imran: “So the creative command is not separate from the creator in any sense, right?”

“And the angels called to him as he stood praying in the sanctuary: Allah gives you glad tidings of (a son whose name is) John, (who comes) to confirm A WORD (bikalimatin) from Allah lordly, chaste, a prophet of the righteous. (Qur’an 3:39)

Are we sure that we want to say that Jesus (A WORD) from Allah is not separate from the Creator?

On what consistent basis is Jesus Allah’s word and his spirit and yet be created when the Qur’an is Allah’s word and is eternal and uncreated? On what consistent basis is the claim made?

We are quite certain that Christians are going to be asking themselves why should I leave Christianity, which holds (even in the lesser Arian Christology) that Christ Jesus is a word emanating from the divine nature but sharing the divine nature only to embrace a faith that tells me that Christ Jesus is a word emanating from the divine being but not separate from the divine being?

“His are the creation and the command.” (Qur’an 7:54)


This is answered by the context itself:

Indeed, your Lord is Allah, who created the heavens and earth in six days and then established Himself above the Throne. He covers the night with the day, [another night] chasing it rapidly; and [He created] the sun, the moon, and the stars, subjected by His command. Unquestionably, His is the creation and the command; blessed is Allah, Lord of the worlds. (Qur’an 7:54)

The most that this verse tells us is that, just as Allah (swt) is alone in bringing the universe out of non-being (into being), in the same way, He is alone in the management of it. He has no partner in its creation and in its management. None other than Him has anything of the creation and management. Rather, to HIM alone belong the creation and the command. The meaning here, clearly, is management. And there is nothing in that which even remotely points either to the eternity of the Qur’an or to its contingency.

Examples:

“Maintain with care the [obligatory] prayers and [in particular] the middle prayer and stand before Allah, devoutly obedient.” (Qur’an 2:238)

The middle prayer is not (separated) out of the genus of prayers, the guarding of which has been commanded.

“Whoever is an enemy to Allah and His angels and His messengers and Gabriel and Michael – then indeed, Allah is an enemy to the disbelievers. (Qur’an 2:98)

No one says that Gabriel and Michael are separated out of the genus of angels. The difference between them is relative.

“Indeed, Allah orders justice and good conduct and giving to relatives and forbids immorality and bad conduct and oppression. He admonishes you that perhaps you will be reminded.” (Qur’an 16:90)

No intelligent person will argue about justice being the doing of good, and the doing of good being justice.

The command (amr) of Allah (swt) has been mentioned jointly with what denotes its creation in many places.

“And [remember, O Muhammed], when you said to the one on whom Allah bestowed favor and you bestowed favor, “Keep your wife and fear Allah,” while you concealed within yourself that which Allah is to disclose. And you feared the people, while Allah has more right that you fear Him. So when Zayd had no longer any need for her, We married her to you in order that there not be upon the believers any discomfort concerning the wives of their adopted sons when they no longer have need of them. And ever is the command of Allah accomplished.” (Qur’an 33:37)

“[Remember] when you were on the near side of the valley, and they were on the farther side, and the caravan was lower [in position] than you. If you had made an appointment [to meet], you would have missed the appointment. But [it was] so that Allah might accomplish a matter already destined – that those who perished [through disbelief] would perish upon evidence and those who lived [in faith] would live upon evidence; and indeed, Allah is Hearing and Knowing.” (Qur’an 8:42)

“There is not to be upon the Prophet any discomfort concerning that which Allah has imposed upon him. [This is] the established way of Allah with those [prophets] who have passed on before. And ever is the command of Allah a destiny decreed.” (Qur’an 33:38)

“He arranges [each] matter from the heaven to the earth; then it will ascend to Him in a Day, the extent of which is a thousand years of those which you count.” (Qur’an 32:5)

“Indeed, all things We created with predestination And Our command is but one, like a glance of the eye.” (Qur’an 54:49-50)

“Do the disbelievers await [anything] except that the angels should come to them or there comes the command of your Lord? Thus did those do before them. And Allah wronged them not, but they had been wronging themselves.” (Qur’an 16:33)

All of those examples should be more than sufficient to show our response!

May Allah (swt) open the eyes of the Muslim ummah. May Allah (swt) open the heart of Joshua and bring him to the right way.

If you would like to see more articles on the discussion of the Qur’an, is it created or uncreated? You may wish to see the following:

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/lets-attack-hamza-yusuf-in-ramadan-the-quran-is-created/

May Allah Guide the Ummah.

May Allah Forgive the Ummah.

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Adoptionist Theology: How did Jesus Become The Son of God?

“And they say: The Beneficent has adopted a son. Glory be to Him! Nay, they are honored, slaves.”(Qur’an 21:26)

“But the Jews and the Christians say, “We are the children of Allah and His beloved.” Say, “Then why does He punish you for your sins?” Rather, you are human beings from among those He has created. He forgives whom He wills, and He punishes whom He wills. And to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them, and to Him is the [final] destination.” (Qur’an 5:18)

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“They say: “(Allah) Most Gracious has begotten a son!” Indeed you have put forth a thing most monstrous! At it the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down in utter ruin, That they should invoke a son (like-kind) for (Allah) Most Gracious. For it is not consonant with the majesty of (Allah) Most Gracious that He should beget a (like-kind) son.” (Qur’an 19:88-92)

“Say, He Allah is Absolute. That which is indepenent of all but which all things are dependent upon. He does not bring forth like kind nor was he from like kind. And there is no equivalent to His being Absolute.” (Qur’an 112:1-4)

THE BIBLE’S POSITION

For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever shall believe in him will not perish but have everlasting life.(John 3:16 King James Version)

What does begotten mean? (According to the English language)

Answer: Begotten is a past participle of beget.

Beget begot, begotten: To become the father of: sire

Sire 1: Father 2: The male parent of an animal (as a horse or dog) sired, siring, PRO-CREATE

Source: (The Merriam Webster’s Dictionary For Large Print Users)

Beget – give birth to

Source: (Webster’s Dictionary)

It is indeed blasphemous to ascribe offspring to the Almighty Allah. It is also insulting to the human intellect of any rational person. All Christians of every sect believe Jesus is the ‘Son of God’.

Allah declares that ascribing a son or any offspring to him is a thing most blasphemous.

We as human beings have children to pro-create our species, and to ensure that humanity survives. We will all die; therefore it is a necessity that sons and daughters take our place.

However, Allah is Ever-Living and needs no such means for survival.

Christians will object and say this is a misrepresentation of their beliefs. Yet, they will claim we know it means ‘Sired by God’, but that is not what we believe!

What does begotten mean? (According to the Greek language)

The references for both are as follows:

Source: (https://biblehub.com/greek/3439.htm)

Source: (https://biblehub.com/interlinear/john/3-16.htm)

Their own dictionaries describe Christ Jesus as God’s ‘offspring’ and ‘stock’.

We will now walk through the development of this all-important Christian concept. We will show conclusively how an innocuous expression ‘Son of God‘ became Jesus ‘The Son of God’ in the very theologically loaded sense that it is today.

This very belief latter transforms into ‘God the Son’ the second member of the ever infamous Tri-theistic Trinity of the Athanasian Creed.

SONS BY THE TONS

As Sheikh Ahmed Deedat used to say:

The terms ‘Son of God’ and ‘children of God’ are often used throughout the Bible.

EXAMPLES:

You are children of the Lord your God(Deuteronomy 14:1)

He shall build a house for my name, and he shall be my son, and I will be his father.(I Chronicles 22:10)

Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.” (Job 1:6)

I have said, you are gods; and all of you are children of the Most High(Psalms 82:6-7)

“...For I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.” (Jeremiah 31:9)

Have we not one father?” “Has not one God created us?” (Malachi 2:10)

Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the sons of God(Matthew 5:9)

For unto which of the angels, said he at any time, You are my Son, this day have I begotten you? And again, I will be to him A FATHER, and he shall be tome A SON?” (Hebrews 1:5)

Prima Qur’an Comments:

In none of the above quotations are the terms ‘children of God’ or ‘Son of God’ understood to be non-allegorical. So why in the case of Jesus is he understood to be the non-allegorical ‘Son of God’.

If you will pay special attention to the last quotation of Hebrews 1:5 you will see that Jesus is ‘A’ Son and God is ‘A’ Father unto him. It does not say Jesus is ‘THE’ Son and God is ‘THE’ father of Jesus.

The reason why Jesus is ‘a’ son and God is ‘a’ father has to do with adoptionist theology.

Jesus a righteous man or ‘son of God’?

When the centurion and those with him who were guarding Jesus saw the earthquake and all that had happened, they were terrified, and exclaimed, “Surely he was the Son of God!” (Matthew 27:54)

“The centurion, seeing what had happened, praised God and said, “Surely this was a righteous man.”(Luke 23:47)

So we can see that Matthew and Luke report the centurion saying two different things? So is this a contradiction or an acceptable allegory? We would say that this is not a contradiction it is an acceptable allegory. That ‘son of God’ simply meant a righteous servant, one near to God.

Son of God or Slave of God?

“And they say: The Beneficent has adopted a son. Glory be to Him! Nay, they are honored, slaves.(Qur’an 21:26)

“Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.” (Acts 3:26 King James Version)

“To you first, God, having raised up His Servant Jesus, sent Him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from your iniquities.” (Acts 3:26 New King James Version)

Notice that the King James Version calls Jesus “his Son”,Whereas the New King James Version calls Jesus “His Servant” and whenever you see that word “servant” in the New Testament, it means slave.

WHAT IS ADOPTIONIST THEOLOGY?

Adoptinonist theology:

Adoptionist refers to a person who believes that Jesus became the Son of God at his baptism, while adoptionism is the theological doctrine that Jesus was born a mere mortal and was later adopted as the Son of God.

What are the text used in the Bible to support this view held by early Christians?

“I will be to him a father, and he shall be to Me a son; so that when he goes astray I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the sons of Adam.” (2 Samuel 7:14)

Prima Qur’an comments:

  1. I am not currently his father but I will be.
  2. He is not currently my son but he will be.
  3. I will be to him ‘a’ father. Not ‘the’ father.
  4. He will be to me ‘a’ son. Not ‘the’ son.
  5. If he goes astray he will be chastened.

Here we have a concept of God appointing someone to be his son, or we may say a righteous servant.

This is also stated in Psalms 2:2 and Psalms 2:7 in a reference to King David.

“The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord, and against his anointed.” (Psalms 2:2)

“I will declare the decree: the Lord has said unto me, You are my Son; This day have I begotten you.” (Psalms 2:7)

Note: It has this day I have begotten you. It is being said to King David while he is alive and a grown adult. David was appointed by adoption to be the ‘son of God’.

A THEOLOGY TAKES SHAPE

We will now show how ‘Son of God’ in New Testament theology takes a total and complete departure from how ‘Son of God’ was used in the Old Testament.

Now I will give you the proof text which shows how Jesus went from being the adopted ‘Son of God’ to the non-allegorical ‘Son of God’.

ADOPTIONIST THEOLOGY BEHIND THE BAPTISM OF JESUS

And there came a voice from heaven, saying, YOU ARE my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” (Mark 1:11)

Note: The voice from heaven addressed Jesus. The Greek for YOU is su (SU).

And there came a voice from heaven, saying, “THIS IS my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” (Mathew 3:17)

Note: The voice from heaven talks about Jesus. The Greek for THIS IS outos (HOUTOS).

Question: Why the change in voice?

Why would one writer deliberately alter the wording of the text?

Answer: The theology!

Mark’s theology held that Jesus became the ‘Son of God’ at baptism, much like David’s coronation in 2 Samuel 7:14

Matthew’s theology held that Jesus was already the ‘Son of God’ based on the virgin birth.

So Jesus does not need to know who he is. Thus, the voice is changed from “You are my son” to an announcement to the ignorant crowd: “This is my son.”

The Qur’an and the Gospel of Luke reject Matthew’s claim.

Note: Look at the Gospel of Luke and Qur’an say in response to Matthew’s claim about Jesus being the ‘son of God’ based upon the virgin birth.

“And they had no child because Elizabeth was barren, and they were now well stricken in years.” (Luke 1:7)

“And Zacharias said unto the angel, how shall I know this? I am an old man, and wife is well stricken in years. And the angel answered said to him, “I am Gabriel who stands in the presence of God; I am sent to speak unto you and to show you glad tidings.” (Luke 1:18-19)

(His prayer was answered): “O Zakariya!” We give you good news of a son: His name shall be Yahya: on none by that name have We conferred distinction before.” He said: “O my Lord”! How shall I have a son, when my wife is barren, and I have grown quite decrepit from old age?” He said: “So (it will be) your Lord says, ‘that is easy for Me: I did indeed create you before when you had been nothing!‘” (Qur’an 19:7-9)

Prima Qur’an Comment: Allah asks Zechariah to reflect upon the fact that he was created indeed before he was nothing

“Relate in the Book (the story of) Mary, when she withdrew from her family to a place in the East. She placed a screen (to screen herself) from them; then We sent her our angel, and he appeared before her as a man in all respects. She said: “I seek refuge from thee to (Allah) Most Gracious: (come not near) if thou dost fear Allah.” He said: ” I am only a messenger from your Lord, (to announce) to you the gift of a holy son. She said: “How shall I have a son, seeing that no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste?” He said: “So (it will be): Your Lord says, ‘that is easy for Me: and (We wish) to appoint him as a Sign unto men and a Mercy from Us’: It is a matter (so) decreed.” (Qur’an 19:16-21)

The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: “Be”. And he was.(Qur’an 3:59)

Prima Qur’an Comment: All glory to be to Allah! Allah explains things in a very simple manner for Christians. Allah says that Adam was made from dust(nothingness) and he was simply willed into being. Thus, as Allah (swt) made Adam from nothingness, likewise Christ Jesus, as the word of Allah, is the created word of Allah. Just as all of Allah’s words are created. Jesus, as the kalim of Allah, was created from nothingness.

THE CREATION OF 5 TYPES OF HUMAN BEINGS:


1) Adam was made without a man or a woman and not divine!

2) Eve made without a woman and not divine!

3) Jesus made without a man and not divine!

4) Isaac and John made while their parents were old, infertile, and not divine!

5) The rest of humanity is made of man and woman and not divine!

THE LUKE FACTOR

Luke’s version of the baptism of Jesus:

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, YOU ARE my beloved Son; in you, I am well pleased.(Luke 3:22)

Note:

1) Luke has the story of the virgin birth

2) Luke has Jesus addressed ‘you are’.

“A few MSS [“D”, “o”, “b”] and Patristic citations representing the “Western” text, have, instead of (You are my beloved Son, in you, I am well pleased), the words of Psalms 2:7, You are my son this day have I begotten you.

“Numerous expositors (e.g. W. Mason, Zahn, Klostermann, Harnack, Moffat, Streeter) accept this variant reading as the original. The majority then explain the alteration of the text from the fact that copyists regarded these words as a contradiction to the reality of the virgin birth.”

Source: [The New International Commentary on the New Testament: The Gospel of Luke by Norval Geldenhuys p. 148]

Prima Qur’an Comment: If we take the above evidence, then the baptism of Jesus (according to Luke) would look like this:

“And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, “You are my son, this day have I begotten you”. (Luke 3:22)

This would mean that Jesus became the ‘son of God’ at his baptism as an adult in the same way David became the ‘son of God’ as an adult.

Let’s continue…

“More important still is the fact that the heavenly voice which greeted Jesus at his baptism hailed him in the opening words of the decree of Psalms 2:7You are my SonMark 1:11

“Indeed, the “Western” text of Luke 3:22 represents the fuller wording from Psalms 2:7 which is quoted here by the author of Hebrews 1:5

“For unto which of the angels said he at any time, You are my Son. “This day have I begotten you?” (Hebrews 1:5)

“The words were evidently in widespread use as a testimonial in the apostolic age, as Acts 13:33 bears witness, and not only these words but the other parts of psalms were given a messianic interpretation, as may be seen from the quotation and explanation of its first two verses in Acts 4:25.

Source: [The New International Commentary on the New Testament: The Epistle to the Hebrews FF. Bruce]

“God has fulfilled the same unto us, their children, in that he has raised Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalms, You are my Son, this day have I begotten you.” (Acts 13:33)

“Why does the heathen rage, and people imagine a vain thing? “The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord, and against his ANOINTED.” (Psalms 2:1-2)

“Who, by the mouth of your SERVANT David, has said, Why DID the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things? “The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his CHRIST.” (Acts 4:25-26)

Note: Some important points need to be made.

David was called ANOINTED (Christ). Also, Luke says David was a SERVANT (Slave) of God. This also means Jesus is like David: He is Anointed, meaning appointed by God. Jesus is also the Servant (slave) of God!

Let’s continue…

“Likewise, certain early manuscripts of Luke quote all of Psalms 2:7: Luke 3:22 in Codex Bezae, and certain old Latin Manuscripts used by Justin, Clement, Origen, and Augustine read, “You are my Son this day have I begotten you.”

But interestingly, Luke also used Psalms 2:7, in a speech composed for Paul.

In Paul’s theology, Jesus was “DECLARED to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead” (Romans 1:4)

“Luke apparently knew of this Pauline teaching for he has Paul quoting Psalms 2:7 as a speech uttered to Jesus at his resurrection, and not his baptism! Acts 13:32-33

“For Luke and Paul Psalms 2:7 is a RESURRECTION prophecy and not a BAPTISM prophecy.”

Source: (Gospel Fictions: Randel Helms pg. 32, 38)

LUKE: He sees the water Jesus is baptized in as ‘the grave’. When Jesus comes out of the water, it is his ‘resurrection.’ The water is symbolic: of ‘being washed by the blood’ of Jesus.

MARK: believed Jesus to be the adopted ‘Son of God’. In the same way, David was the adopted ‘Son of God’, Thus Jesus became the ‘Son of God’ at his baptism.

MATTHEW: believed Jesus was the non-allegorical ‘Son of God’ based on the virgin birth.

LUKE AND PAUL: believe Jesus was the non-allegorical ‘Son of God’ based on his resurrection from the dead.

Note: Paul said Jesus was ‘Declared’ to be the ‘Son of God’ not that HE WAS the ‘Son of God’

Source: Romans 1:3

What do Christians mean: Jesus is the ‘Son of God’?

Examination time!

We have already seen what begotten means. Not only this but every modern translation of the Bible does away with the term ‘begotten‘?

Why?

Answer:

1) Because David was called, ‘the begotten Son of God’: in Psalms (2:7). You cannot have Jesus be the ‘only-begotten’ when David is already begotten.

2) Hebrews 11:17

By faith, Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac; and he that had received the promise offered up his only-begotten son.”

  1. a) This is a flat contradiction because Ishmael was begotten before Isaac was.
  2. b) Or this is not to be understood as allegorical.

We know this is not understood literally. Isaac is not the only-begotten son; just as Jesus is not the non-allegorical ‘son of God’.

Question: Is Jesus ‘eternally begotten’ by the father?

Answer: No!

Hebrews 1:5

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, You are my Son?” This day have I begotten you?”

Prima Qur’an Comment: Jesus cannot be ‘eternally begotten’ by the father when this passage clearly states ‘This day’ have I begotten you. Indeed, one would wonder what day that is.

Tertullian did not believe in the eternality of the son.

For example, to me, it is very clear that Tertullian did not believe in the eternality of the son based upon the following:

“Because God is in like manner a Father, and He is also a Judge; but He has not always been Father and Judge, merely on the ground of His having always been God. For He could not have been the Father previous to the Son, nor a Judge previous to sin. There was, however, a time when neither sin existed with Him, nor the Son; the former of which was to constitute the Lord a Judge, and the latter a Father.”

Source: (https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0313.htm)

When the Church decided upon the doctrine of Tri-theism they had to make Jesus co-equal and co-eternal with the father in so doing the doctrine of adoption created huge problems for them. Not only this but if Jesus was indeed begotten ‘this day’ he would not be co-eternal. This is why the Church called Jesus ‘eternally begotten’.

There is no Greek text to support the idea that Jesus is ‘eternally begotten‘ That is why to meet the strong arguments of Bishop Arius his fellow Christians could only respond with two things:

1. Violence.

2. Use an oxymoron ‘eternally begotten‘.

The Greek text is monogenes

How do other Bibles translate John 3:16

“For God so loved the world that he gave his only son (or the unique son of God), that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have life eternal.” [The Living Bible] John 3:16

“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son, that whosoever shall believe in him shall not perish but have everlasting life.” [New International Version] John 3:16

“For God so loved the world that he gave his only son, that whosoever shall believe in him shall not perish but have eternal life.” [Revised Standard Version] John 3:16

“For God so loved the world that he gave his only son that whosoever shall believe in him shall not perish but have eternal life.” [The New American Bible] John 3:16

Note: All of the above translations say something like ‘Only Son’ or ‘Unique Son’.

  1. a) Either this is a flat contradiction because, as shown from Hebrews 1:5 Jesus is ‘A’ Son not ‘Thee’ Son of God.
  2. b) Or this is to be understood as allegorical!

We know this is not to be taken nonallegorically. Jesus is not the only son because, as already proven, God has many ‘sons’.

As far as the ‘Unique Son’ is concerned, every ‘Son of God’ is unique! So, once again, Christians are at a loss to explain how Jesus is the non-allegorical ‘Son of God’.

Remember that Jesus never once claimed to be the ‘only son’ of God!

Christians started to see the problem with John 3:16 translations. In a classic debate between Christian televangelist Jimmy Swaggart and Muslim debater Ahmed Deedat, Swaggart anticipated a possible question of Deedat by saying the following:

@ 8:53 minutes “Now I want to start this off tonight by quoting a passage of scripture that Mr. Deedat and myself disagree somewhat over. But which is one of if not the dearest passage in the word of God to the world of Christendom. Found in St. John 3:16

“For God so loved the world that he gave his only unique Son (Fooled you there Mr. Deedat), his only unique son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.”

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlA22NNFlDw

CONCLUSION:

The Christians should repent to Allah for every ascribing a non-allegorical son to him. Glory be to Allah who has not adopted a son or daughter! It can be seen how Jesus was called the ‘Son of God’ in the same way that previous people were called ‘Sons of God’.

However, this concept slowly evolved from being the adopted son of God into Jesus being the non-allegorical ‘Son of God’ and eventually led to him being ‘eternally begotten God’

May Allah bring the people out of the great darkness into the light. May Allah guide us to the truth!

“And when they hear what has been revealed to the Messenger, you see their eyes overflowing with tears because of what they have recognized of the truth. They say, “Our Lord, we have believed, so register us among the witnesses.”(Qur’an 5:83)

Back to main section: https://primaquran.com/christianity/

You may also be interested in reading:

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/the-evidence-to-reject-the-virgin-birth-of-jesus/

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/the-case-for-the-virgin-birth-from-the-quran/

May Allah Guide the Ummah.

May Allah Forgive the Ummah.

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A Jewish Argument against the Qur’an.

“Also, mention when the angels said, “O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good news of a word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary – distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near to Allah. He will speak to the people in the cradle and in maturity and will be of the righteous. “She said, “My Lord, how will I have a child when no man has touched me?” The angel said, “Such is Allah; He creates what He wills. When He decrees a matter, He only says to it, ‘Be,’ and it is. (Qur’an 3:45-47)

﷽ 

“Also, mention, in the book the story of Mary, when she withdrew from her family to a place toward the east and she took, in seclusion from them, a screen. Then We sent to her Our Angel, and he represented himself to her as a well-proportioned man. She said, “Indeed, I seek refuge in the Most Merciful from you, so leave me, if you should be fearing of Allah. He said, “I am only the messenger of your Lord to give you news of a pure boy. “She said, “How can I have a boy while no man has touched me and I have not been unchaste? “He said, “Thus it will be; your Lord says, ‘it is easy for Me, and We will make him a sign to the people and a mercy from Us. And it is a matter already decreed.” (Qur’an 19:16-21)

As Shaykh Ahmed Deedat (r) has mentioned in his Pamphlet “Is the Bible God’s Word?” page 11:

We do not have the time and space to go into the tens of thousands of — grave or minor —defects that the authors of the Revised Standard Version (RSV) have attempted to revise. We leave that privilege to the Christian scholars of the Bible. Here I will endeavor to cast just a cursory glance at a “half-a-dozen” or so of those “minor” changes.


1. “Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign: Behold, a VIRGIN shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.” (Isaiah 7:14 – AV)
The indispensable “VIRGIN” in the above verse has now been replaced in the RSV with the phrase “a young woman,” which is the correct translation of the Hebrew word almah. Almah is the word that has occurred all along in the Hebrew text and NOT bethulah, which means VIRGIN. This correction is only to be found in the English language translation, as the RSV is only published in this tongue. For the African and the Afrikaner, the Arab and the Zulu, in fact, in the 1500 other languages of the world, Christians are made to continue to swallow the misnomer “VIRGIN.”

The argument goes (from the Jews) and the atheists, for that matter, that if the Gospel writer ‘Matthew’ had been inspired and directed by the Holy Spirit, then he (Matthew) would not have relied upon the Jewish Septuagint for the source of his quote.

Technically, the word almah more than not was used for a young woman that could be married. Being a young, unmarried woman, it was often understood that she was not married and thus, a virgin.

However, those who argue against this state that the word ‘bethulah’, which actually does mean virgin, should have been used in place of ‘almah’, which has the possibility of being a virgin.

The website: Jews for Jesus has the following to say:

https://jewsforjesus.org/publications/issues/issues-v09-n01/almah-virgin-or-young-maiden/

Whereas the web site Jews for Judaism as this short entry:

https://jewsforjudaism.org/knowledge/articles/almah-virgin-and-parthenos

We as Muslims could agree with our Christian apologist and say look, ‘almah’likely means ‘virgin’ and that is good enough.

The reason that it is not good enough is that the author of the ‘Gospel According to Matthew’ had made some huge blunders when being reliant upon the Greek Septuagint.

We will give a clear example: Believe us, there are many!

“When they drew near Jerusalem and came to Bethphage on the Mount of Olives, Jesus sent two disciples, saying to them, “Go into the village opposite you, and immediately you will find an ass tethered, and a colt with her. Untie them and bring them here to me. And if anyone should say anything to you, reply, ‘The master has need of them.’ Then he will send them at once. “This happened so that what had been spoken through the prophet might be fulfilled: Say to daughter Zion, ‘Behold, your king comes to you, meek and riding on an ass, and on a colt, the foal of a beast of burden.’ “The disciples went and did as Jesus had ordered them. They brought the ass and the colt and laid their cloaks over them, and he sat upon them. The huge crowd spread their cloaks on the road, while others cut branches from the trees and strewed them on the road. The crowds preceding him and those following kept crying out and saying: “Hosanna to the Son of David; blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord; hosanna in the highest.” And when he entered Jerusalem the whole city was shaken and asked, “Who is this? “And the crowds replied, “This is Jesus the prophet, from Nazareth in Galilee.” (Matthew 21:1-11)

This is disastrous. It is disastrous on several accounts. Whoever wrote the Gospel according to Matthew couldn’t have known the original Hebrew text. Instead, the Greek Septuagint was relied upon resulting in the mistaken belief that the so-called “prophecy” was about Jesus riding upon two donkeys!

Again, look at what Christian scholars have had to say about the matter.

4-5] The prophet: this fulfillment citation is actually composed of two distinct Old Testament texts, Isaiah 62:11 (Say to daughter Zion) and Zechariah 9:9. The ass and the colt are the same animal in the prophecy, mentioned twice in different ways, the common Hebrew literary device of poetic parallelism. Matthew takes them as two is one of the reasons why some scholars think that he was a Gentile rather than a Jewish Christian who would presumably not make that mistake (see Introduction).

7] Upon them: upon the two animals; an awkward picture resulting from Matthew’s misunderstanding of the prophecy.

The source is from: (http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/matthew/matthew28.htm)

So why could this be a Jewish contention against the Qur’an?

The Core of the Critique.

The criticism, as we’ve laid out, follows this logic:

The Christian Doctrine is Based on a Mistranslation: The Christian belief in a virgin birth prophecy in Isaiah 7:14 relies on the Greek Septuagint’s translation of the Hebrew word almah (young woman) as parthenos (virgin), rather than the more precise Hebrew word for virgin, bethulah.

Matthew’s Error Demonstrates Human Authorship: The author of the Gospel of Matthew (who used the Septuagint) further demonstrates his human fallibility by misreading Zechariah 9:9, thinking it describes two animals (an ass and a colt) instead of one animal described with poetic parallelism.

The Qur’an is Therefore Derivative and Human: Since the Qur’an also affirms the virgin birth, the critic argues that its author simply borrowed this “mistaken” Christian doctrine, which itself is based on a Greek mistranslation of a Hebrew text. This, they claim, proves the Qur’an is a human document from the 7th century, not a divine revelation.

The assumption that the Jew could make is that because Muslims believe in the virgin birth of Mary (May Allah honour her) that the “author of the Qur’an” simply copied the Christian doctrine — which in turn is based upon the Greek Septuagint and has no knowledge of the Hebrew text. Presumably, this makes the Qur’an all too human and not of divine authorship.

The Qur’an is Independent and Authoritative, Not Derivative.
This is the most critical point. The Qur’an does not seek to prove the virgin birth by referencing the Hebrew Bible. It does not say, “And this happened to fulfill what was said by the prophet Isaiah…” as Matthew does.

Instead, the Qur’an narrates the event as a direct, fact revealed by Allah.

We as Muslims have a straightforward response to this. That is that whoever wrote the ‘Gospel according to Matthew’ was quote-mining the Jewish sacred text to get legitimacy for Jesus as the Messiah. Whereas, for us as Muslims, the Qur’an stands independent of any justification for the miraculous birth of Christ Jesus.

Muslims could agree with Christian apologists that almah can imply virginity. However, the Islamic position is stronger: We have no theological need to enter that debate. Our belief is not contingent on the interpretation of a single word in a text that could have been altered. Our belief is based solely on the clear, unambiguous words of the Qur’an:

“She said, ‘How can I have a boy while no man has touched me and I have not been unchaste?’ He said, ‘Thus [it will be]; your Lord says, ‘It is easy for Me…” (Qur’an 19:20-21)

The Qur’an uses the phrase “while no man has touched me” (وَلَمْ يَمْسَسْنِي بَشَرٌ), which is an explicit, clear statement of virginity that avoids the ambiguity of the Hebrew almah altogether

In other words, Christ Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary. This is our belief as Muslims who believe in the words of the Qur’an.

This was a real event that took place. Where we part with the Christians is this:

The Christians in particular whoever wrote the ‘Gospel according to Matthew’ felt a need to justify this event by reference to the Hebrew scriptures albeit reliance upon the Greek Septuagint.

More examples:

Contextomy: How New Testament writers quote the Old Testament for prophecies.

To show the reader that it is not very difficult to take passages out of context in the “Old Testament” and make them apply to Jesus, we decided to see if we were any good at it. None of these are prophecies that Christians currently accept. However, we quote mined the Tanach and found things that could be applicable to Jesus. This is known as contextomy. Thus, you could take any real life event of Jesus (as) and then try to find some text in the Tanach to make it applicable to that event.

You the reader be the judge.

“And Jesus increased in wisdom and in stature and in favor with God and man, thus fulfilling what was WRITTEN of him.” (Luke 2:52)

Well, we would then have a {footnote} that would say (Proverbs 3:4). You, the Christian wanting to see the amazing ‘prophecy’ fulfillment’ would turn to find.

“And you will find favor and understanding in the sight of God and man.” (Proverbs 3:4)

So that is fulfilled in Jesus. If not, why not?

“And they all forsook him and fled, thus fulfilling what was WRITTEN of him.” (Mark 14:50)

We would then have a {footnote} that would say (Isaiah 53:3). You, the Christian wanting to see the amazing ‘prophecy’ fulfilled, would turn to find:

“He was despised and rejected by men; a man of sorrows and acquainted with grief; and as one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not.” (Isaiah 53:3)

So that was fulfilled when the disciples all left Jesus. If not, why not?

“Jesus wept, thus fulfilling what the scripture said concerning him.” (John 11:35)

We would then have a {footnote} giving (Psalms 69:3). You, the Christian wanting to see this amazing ‘prophecy’ fulfilled, would then find:

” I am weary with my crying; my throat is parched. My eyes grow dim with waiting for my God.” (Psalms 69:3)

So this was fulfilled when Jesus wept. If not. why not?

If Christians object that these examples are ‘taken out of context,’ then they must apply the same standard to their own proof-texts. Context matters, unless it is being used to support a theological agenda.

Conclusion:

The mistakes of Matthew highlight the human process of trying to fit Jesus into Old Testament prophecies, sometimes through forced interpretations and errors from using a translation.

The Qur’an, by contrast, displays none of this. It is entirely self-contained and authoritative. It does not make interpretive errors about Zechariah or Isaiah because it does not reference them in the first place. It simply states the truth of the event as revealed by Allah.

Therefore, the argument that the Qur’an “copied” a mistake actually proves the opposite: its independence from the textual corruptions and human errors that affected the previous scriptures. The Qur’an’s account of the virgin birth is not evidence of its human origin but rather of its divine origin, as it provides a pristine, uncorrupted narrative free from the dilemmas of biblical scholarship.

As Muslims, our belief in this stands apart from needing any proof text or citation from previous scriptures. With Allah is the success!

May Allah (swt) guide the sincere among them so that they do not perish in ever lasting hellfire!

May Allah Guide the Ummah.

May Allah Forgive the Ummah.

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Why Jesus Is Not The Name of God.

O People of the Scripture, do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Isa, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul [created at a command] from Him. So, believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, “Three”; desist – it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs.” (Qur’an 4:171)

﷽ 

The name of God and the name of Jesus are distinctly different.

“The victor I will make into a pillar in the temple of my God, and he will never leave it again. On him, I will inscribe the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from my God, as well as my new name.” (Revelation 3:12)

Prima Qur’an Comment:

From the above text it can be seen that ‘the name of my God‘ AND ‘my new name‘ are distinctly different.

This becomes obvious from the fact that Jesus is a common name, like John, James, or Peter. The above text of Revelation 3:12 was taken from a ‘Red Lettered‘ New Testament, where the words of Jesus are in red.


JESUS IS NOT THE NAME OF GOD…

Many times, our Christians tell us that Jesus is the name of God. It is a name ‘above every name’. After all, how can a person have a personal relationship with God if you don’t know the name of God? I guess that sounds reasonable.

However, what most Christians are not aware of is the fact that the Hebrew language does not have a J. So, if the Jews spoke Hebrew, you know they didn’t pronounce Jesus with a ‘J‘.

The other point that is not realized so readily by our Christian sisters and brothers is that Jesus is really quite an ordinary name. It has no power in and of itself. It was a very common name then and it’s still a common name.

In fact, seeing that Spanish is ranked as the number 3 language in the world, Jesus, pronounced Hey Zeus, is a very common name among men in the Latin American community.

So, this is a rather uneventful name. It would be the equivalent of calling someone Chaz, or Lester or Herbert in English.

Feel free to go to Google Translate and listen to how the name ‘Jesus’ is pronounced.

Go to Google Translate and just listen to the name “Jesus” as it is pronounced in Spanish and Greek.

Go to Google Translate and just listen to the name “Jesus” as it is pronounced in Spanish and Greek.

Even more revealing is the fact that Jesus is a ‘bastardized’ (apologies for the terminology) Latin version of the name Yehoshua in Hebrew, or in other words, Joshua.

The name Yeshua appears 29 times in the Tanach.

Yehoshua (Joshua) of Nun is called Yeshua in Nechemyah (Nehemiah) 8:17. Yeshua is the name of the Cohain HaGadol (the high priest) in the time of Zerubavel in Ezra 3:2. It is the name of a Levite under King Hizkiyah (Hezekiah) in 2 Chronicles 31:15. There is even a city called Yeshua in the negev of Yehudah in Nechemyah11:26.

Yeshua is also a shortened version of the word Yehoshua, much like Bill is for William.

Before anyone gets angry with us using the word ‘bastardized’ in relationship to Jesus (may Allah’s peace and blessings be upon him), one must realize that the word ‘bastardized’ means—to modify, especially by introducing discordant or disparate elements.

Source: http://dictionary.reverso.net/english-cobuild/bastardize

After all, you take a very common name, Joshua, which means — ‘God is my salvation’ and turn it into this Latin that sounds a lot like a former Greek god ‘Zeus’.

Remember when the evangelist screams out in the name of ‘Jeeeee zuuus’. Or the Spanish speaker yells out on stage, “In the name of ‘Hey Zeus’.” Jesus /Zeus.

Hey Zeus. Hail Zeus.

HEY ZEUS! HAIL ZEUS!

In the Qur’an the son of Mary is called ‘Isa‘ or ‘Esau‘.

Recall that Hebrew was a dead language for a long time. It was only when Eliezer Ben Yehuda used the Arabic language to help revive Hebrew that it became a vibrant language again.

Source: https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-eliezer-ben-yehuda-is-turning-in-his-grave-over-israels-humiliation-of-arabic-1.5472510

“One prominent pioneer was Eliezer Ben-Yehuda, the famed Jewish lexicographer widely hailed as the reviver of modern Hebrew, and whose revivalist legacy rested on a genuine recognition of the essential role of Arabic in the rebirth and resurrection of modern Hebrew.

It is quite possible that some Christians may find it strange to use the name ‘Esau‘ or ‘Isa‘ in place of ‘Jesus‘ as there is a passage in the Bible that says that ‘God hates Esau‘.

The oracle of the word of the Lord to Israel by Malachi. “I have loved you,” says the Lord. But you say, “How have you loved us?” “Is not Esau Jacob’s brother?” declares the Lord. “Yet I have loved Jacob, but Esau I have hated.” (Malachi 1:1-3)

God hates Jesus but loves Jacob?

Imagine if in place of the word ‘Esau’ you had the word ‘Joshua’. You would have a very interesting passage in the Bible of God saying, “But Jesus, I hate.”

Let’s continue with Eliezer Ben Yehuda.

Since Hebrew, Aramaic, and Arabic are all based upon the same Semitic vowel system, Eliezer used the Arabic language.

A language that was still living and had wide currency to decipher the pronunciation and understanding of the Hebrew language.


Jesus” was a common name back in the day. In Acts 13:6 there was a magician named Bar Jesus.

When they had travelled through the whole island as far as Paphos, they met a magician named Bar-Jesus who was a Jewish false prophet.”

In Colossians 4:11 there was a contemporary of Paul called Jesus-Justus

And Jesus, who is called Justus, who are of the circumcision; these alone are my co-workers for the kingdom of God, and they have been a comfort to me.”

Another interesting example of two people called “Jesus” side by side in the following text:

So, when the crowd had gathered, Pilate asked them, “Which one do you want me to release to you: Jesus Barabbas, or Jesus who is called the Messiah?” (Matthew 27:17).

So, the people had the choice to have Jesus ‘son of the father‘ or Jesus ‘called Messiah‘ killed.


So, the name “Jesus” was a common name, like John, James or Mary.

This doesn’t sound like a ‘Name Above All Names’ to me. It sounds rather common and uneventful.

Do Christians Feel Power in The Name of Joshua?

We are whether we can call upon the name of Joshua and be saved? It is, however, the same as “Jesus”. Why should only the ‘bastardized‘ form of the Latin version of ‘Yehoshua‘ be the only name for salvation?

In other words, is the Christian mission only done in English? No it is not!

So, if there are Jews, wouldn’t they be screaming out ‘Yehoshua‘ in the congregation?

That being the case, why couldn’t they scream out ‘Joshua‘ as it is the Anglicized form?

Joshua Christ?


Imagine using terms like Joshua Christ! Imagine Christian missionaries asking people to accept faith in Joshua? Imagine Benny Hinn jumping up and down and healing people in the name of Joshua! Or imagine John Hagee being slain in the spirit of Joshua Christ!

What about the name Immanuel?

Immanuel is also a common Jewish name which means ‘God is with us‘.

Maher-shalal-hash-baz was called Immanuel in Isaiah 8:8

It shall pass into Judah and flood it all throughout up to the neck it shall reach; It shall spread its wings the full width of your land, Immanuel!

So, for Christians to say, “Hey look, there is a prophecy that says he will be called Immanuel, We can tell them that Maher-shalal-hash-baz was also called Immanuel.”

In Matthew 1:23 we read: “Behold, the virgin shall be with a child and shall bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which translated means, “God with us“.”

That this is an example of a failed prophecy plain pure and simple. It’s amazing the lengths that Christian apologists will go through to make this all add up.

In the end, I think that the position of Islam and the Qur’an is very clear. ‘Isa is an Arabized form of the word ‘Esau’. He was born of a virgin named Mariam (Mary).

There is much to be said about the fact that Christians use a name like Jesus (a common name like John, James, or Mary) when describing the ineffable name of the creator.

Maybe there is a way out of this. Maybe, after all, The Creator is not a person, much less person(s).

Since, after all, the words ‘person’ and ‘personality’ come from the Greek word ‘persona’ which means ‘a mask’. Think about it! Tri-Theist Christians believe in a God that is One Being that wears three masks.

In the end, “Jesus” is just a common name, like Chuck, or Daryl or Lester.

We sincerely hope people will read the Qur’an and learn as much as they can about Islam. We hope that Allah Most High opens the breasts and hearts of humanity and that Allah Most Merciful guides us all to what he loves.

“And when they hear what has been revealed to the Messenger, you see their eyes overflowing with tears because of what they have recognized of the truth. They say, “Our Lord, we have believed, so register us among the witnesses.” (Qur’an 5:83)

May Allah Guide the Ummah.

May Allah Forgive the Ummah.

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Text clearly show Jesus is not God and the Bible does not understand human reproduction.

“For the truth stands out clearly from falsehood.” (Qur’an 2:256)

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Let us see which of you reading this are quick-witted to spot the problem. Given what we know about human reproduction, what is the obvious error in sending brother after brother to impregnate a woman that fails to get pregnant?

Source: (Matthew 22:23-32)

“If brethren dwell together, and one of them die, and have no child, the wife of the dead shall not marry without unto a stranger: her husband’s brother shall go in unto her, and take her to him to wife, and perform the duty of an husband’s brother unto her.” (Deuteronomy 25:5)

“Then Judah said to Onan, “Sleep with your brother’s wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to raise up offspring for your brother.”  But Onan knew that the child would not be his; so whenever he slept with his brother’s wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from providing offspring for his brother.  What he did was wicked in the Lord’s sight; so the Lord put him to death also.” (Genesis 38:8-10)

“That same day the Sadducees, who say there is no resurrection, came to him with a question.  “Teacher,” they said, “Moses told us that if a man dies without having children, his brother must marry the widow and raise up offspring for him.  Now there were seven brothers among us. The first one married and died, and since he had no children, he left his wife to his brother.  The same thing happened to the second and third brother, right on down to the seventh.  Finally, the woman died. Now then, at the resurrection, whose wife will she be of the seven, since all of them were married to her?” (Matthew 22:23-28)

You can replace the seven brothers with ten brothers or even 25 brothers if you like.

At what point does one realize that these men are not firing blanks but that this woman is infertile!

The woman has some type of medical condition that is preventing her from getting pregnant. Now if someone wants to raise an objection, stating that in Genesis 38:8-10 Onan was spilling his semen on the ground (coitus interruptus) and that perhaps all the brothers were doing that, it doesn’t help the case either.

  1. Did not have the foresight to realize that people would do this, evading their responsibility?
  2. If the story of Onan was known, the men would realize that God would strike them dead. Thus, the ever looming wrath of God.  
  3. Surely the women are not so gullible as to not know whether a man is ejaculating in them or not.

This law was before modern medicine in which we know that both a man and a woman may have issues of fertility. Given the low esteem that women are generally afforded in the Bible, it is not at all surprising to see the power of pro-creation as something that man is responsible for.

If Jesus was God, he would be aware that both men and women have a part to play in human reproduction. 

In the majority Christian view, Jesus shares the essence (being) of the Father and the Holy Spirit, which means that He (Jesus) gave those laws to Moses, proving further that he cannot be God and that the sacred text of the Jews and Christians are not free from egregious errors.

Another point to take note of:

The text has Jesus (as) say:

 Jesus replied, “You are in error because you do not know the Scriptures or the power of God.”  “At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.” (Matthew 22:29-30)

It looks like Jesus is in error for not knowing the scriptures!

However, the scriptures say:

“And it came to pass when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.” (Genesis 6:1-2)

Jesus claims people will not marry nor be given in marriage being like the angels. Yet the angels themselves took human women as wives.

Now, watch out for the curve ball they (some Christians will throw you) because they will say, “Oh, the text says,” Sons of God” not angels.   But angels are the sons of God. 

You can see where they are used interchangeably here:

https://biblehub.com/job/1-6.htm

“One day the angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came with them.” (Job 1:6 New International Version)

“Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.” (Job 1:6 King James Version)

Lastly, if they persist that sons of God refer to men, then this shows you it is an appellation referring to mortal human beings without any divine connotation.

The Bible’s treatment of fertility is anthropologically conditioned and not scientifically precise.

From a modern scientific perspective, if multiple brothers fail to impregnate the same woman, it is statistically improbable that all men are infertile (assuming they are fertile with other women). The most logical conclusion is that the woman has a fertility issue. This highlights an ancient misunderstanding of reproduction, where infertility was often attributed solely to the woman. However, the levirate law implicitly places the burden on the man’s lineage to continue, ignoring potential female factors.

May Allah guide the sincere truth seekers.

May Allah guide the Ummah.

May Allah forgive the Ummah.

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Prophet David (as) and the dispute between the two men.

“We strengthened his kingship, and gave him wisdom and sound judgment.” (Qur’an 38:20)

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These verses are a case study that strengthen the position of the Ibadi school that Muslims should not rely upon the Israʼiliyyat material to provide further points of elucidation on any matter of our faith.

Narrated Ubaidullah:

Ibn `Abbas said, “Why do you ask the people of the scripture about anything while your Book (Qur’an) which has been revealed to Allah’s Messenger (saw) is newer and the latest? You read it pure, undistorted and unchanged, and Allah has told you that the people of the scripture (Jews and Christians) changed their scripture and distorted it, and wrote the scripture with their own hands and said, ‘It is from Allah,’ to sell it for a little gain. Does not the knowledge which has come to you prevent you from asking them about anything? No, by Allah, we have never seen any man from them asking you regarding what has been revealed to you!”

Source: (https://sunnah.com/bukhari:7363)

Now we are left with a conundrum.

Read, and reflect, dear readers.

Because this hadith is from Ibn Abbas (ra). Ibn Abbas (ra) is clearly telling us not to rely upon the People of the Scripture while we have the Qur’an.

*Note* Ibn Abbas (ra) according to the hadith clearly states:

Does not the knowledge which has come to you prevent you from asking them about anything?

Yet low and behold!

https://quranx.com/Tafsirs/38.21

“(And hath the story of the litigants come unto thee?) Then came to you the story of the opponents of David. (How they climbed the wall into the royal chamber…”

https://quranx.com/Tafsirs/38.22

“How they burst in upon David, and he) David (was afraid of them. They) i.e. the two angels who entered in on David (said: Be not afraid (We are) two litigants, one of whom hath wronged the other, therefore judge aright) justly (between us; be not unjust) do not be partial and transgress not; (and show us the fair way) show us what is right.”

https://quranx.com/Tafsirs/38.23

“(Lo! this my brother hath ninety and nine ewes) meaning 99 wives (while I had one ewe) i.e. one wife; (and he said: Entrust it to me, and he conquered me in speech) this is a similitude which they struck for David in order for him to understand what he did to Uriah.”

https://quranx.com/Tafsirs/38.26

“((And it was said to him): O David! Lo! We have set you as a vicegerent in the earth) We appointed you a prophet king for the Children of Israel; (therefore judge aright between mankind) judge justly between people, (and follow not desire) that as you did regarding Bathseba, the wife of Uriah, who was also David’s cousin (that it beguile you from the way of Allah) from the obedience of Allah. (Lo! those who wander from the way of Allah) from the obedience of Allah (have an awful doom, forasmuch as they forgot the Day of Reckoning) because they forsake working for the Day of Reckoning.”

So now we are in a conundrum. Here are some propositions that require reflection.

  1. The above hadith is not true because Ibn Abbas (ra) apparently is relying upon information that neither the Qur’an nor the Blessed Prophet (saw) provides.
  2. The above hadith is true and this tafsir attributed to Ibn Abbas (ra) needs to be put under a microscope and further scrutiny.
  3. Ibn Abbas (ra) used to believe the statement in the hadith, but later changed his opinion, thus we have the bizarre Israʼiliyyat material in his Tafsir.
  4. The bizarre Israʼiliyyat material in Ibn Abbas (ra) tafsir is about an earlier position he held and the hadith captures a latter position in which he corrected the error of his ways.

We strengthened his kingship, and gave him wisdom and sound judgment. Has the story of the two plaintiffs, who scaled the sanctuary, reached you? When they came into David’s presence, he was startled by them. They said, “Have no fear. We are merely two in a dispute: one of us has wronged the other. So judge between us with truth—do not go beyond it and guide us to the right way. This is my brother. He has ninety-nine sheep while I have one. He asked me to give it up to him, overwhelming me with his argument.” David’s ruling was: “He has definitely wronged you in demanding to add your sheep to his. And certainly many partners wrong each other, except those who believe and do good—but how few are they!” Then David realized that We had tested him so he asked for his Lord’s forgiveness, fell down in prostration, and turned in repentance. So We forgave that for him. And he will indeed have closeness to Us and an honourable destination! “O David! We have surely made you an authority in the land, so judge between people with truth. And do not follow whims or they will lead you astray from Allah’s Way. Surely those who go astray from Allah’s Way will suffer a severe punishment for neglecting the Day of Reckoning.” (Qur’an 38:20-26)

We will give our argument that of the questions that are put forward the position of Ibn Abbas (ra) is either position 2 or 4. The Tafsir attributed to Ibn Abbas (ra) has some bizarre assertions.

In order to believe in either proposition 1 or 3 we would need solid answers to the following questions:

A) Why would angels need to: “climb a wall into a royal chamber?” They are angels why do they need to climb or scale anything?

B) Since when did Prophets serve as a litigant in a dispute with angels?

C) Since when did angels have sheep?

D) Where did Ibn Abbas (ra) get the idea that the sheep are actually women? Why would the Arabic text, which clearly states sheep, be seen as a metaphor for women unless one was reliant upon Israʼiliyyat.

As regards what some commentators think, this is a reference to let me remind the readers of the Biblical account that accuses the Prophet. 

Regarding the incident of King David and Uriah, it is alluded to in the Qur’an (38:21-25) in the Parable of the Ewes. It becomes evident that King David did commit some mistake with regard to taking Uriah’s wife. But, of course, we don’t say he committed adultery with her.


Allegedly Prophet David (as) commits adultery and is culpable in murder according to the Bible.

“Brothers, I can tell you with confidence that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that he would place one of his descendants on his throne.” (Acts 2:29-30)

Next, we have the story of Prophet David (as)

Apparently, if we are to believe the testimony in the Bible concerning David, we find that he was a man who led a woman to commit adultery and committed adultery himself. He lusted after another man’s wife, watched her bath naked. He then had this woman’s husband killed. He tried to hide the fact he made this woman pregnant out of wedlock. This is the same David that, according to Christians, writes all the prophecies concerning Jesus in the 22 Psalms and throughout the Psalms. Even accordingly, David wrote evil things like the following:

“In the morning David wrote a letter to Joab and sent it with Uriah. In it, he wrote, “Put Uriah out in front where the fighting is fiercest. Then withdraw from him so he will be struck down and die.”

If I was to measure the Prophets of the Bible-based upon how some Christians measure the Blessed Prophet Muhammed (saw) I could never become a Christian. I would have to reject the testimony concerning the “prophecies” concerning Jesus in the Psalms.

“One evening David got up from his bed and walked around on the roof of the palace. From the roof, he saw a woman bathing. The woman was very beautiful, and David sent someone to find out about her. The man said, “She is Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam and the wife of Uriah the Hittite.” Then David sent messengers to get her. She came to him, and he slept with her. (Now she was purifying herself from her monthly uncleanness.)

Then she went back home. The woman conceived and sent word to David, saying, “I am pregnant.” “So David sent this word to Joab: “Send me Uriah the Hittite.” And Joab sent him to David. When Uriah came to him, David asked him how Joab was, how the soldiers were, and how the war was going. Then David said to Uriah, “Go down to your house and wash your feet.” So Uriah left the palace, and a gift from the king was sent after him. But Uriah slept at the entrance to the palace with all his master’s servants and did not go down to his house.”

David was told, “Uriah did not go home.” So he asked Uriah, “Haven’t you just come from a military campaign? Why didn’t you go home?” Uriah said to David, “The ark and Israel and Judah are staying in tents, and my commander Joab and my lord’s men are camped in the open country. How could I go to my house to eat and drink and make love to my wife? As surely as you live, I will not do such a thing!”

Then David said to him, “Stay here one more day, and tomorrow I will send you back.” So Uriah remained in Jerusalem that day and the next. At David’s invitation, he ate and drank with him, and David made him drunk. But in the evening Uriah went out to sleep on his mat among his master’s servants; he did not go home.”

” In the morning David wrote a letter to Joab and sent it with Uriah. In it, he wrote, “Put Uriah out in front where the fighting is fiercest. Then withdraw from him so he will be struck down and die.” “So while Joab had the city under siege, he put Uriah at a place where he knew the strongest defenders were. When the men of the city came out and fought against Joab, some of the men in David’s army fell; moreover, Uriah the Hittite died.”

Joab sent David a full account of the battle. He instructed the messenger: “When you have finished giving the king this account of the battle, the king’s anger may flare up, and he may ask you, ‘Why did you get so close to the city to fight? Didn’t you know they would shoot arrows from the wall? Who killed Abimelek son of Jerub-Besheth? Didn’t a woman drop an upper millstone on him from the wall, so that he died in Thebez? Why did you get so close to the wall?’ If he asks you this, then say to him, ‘Moreover, your servant Uriah the Hittite is dead.’”

“The messenger set out, and when he arrived he told David everything Joab had sent him to say. The messenger said to David, “The men overpowered us and came out against us in the open, but we drove them back to the entrance of the city gate. Then the archers shot arrows at your servants from the wall, and some of the king’s men died. Moreover, your servant Uriah the Hittite is dead.” “David told the messenger, “Say this to Joab: ‘Don’t let this upset you; the sword devours one as well as another. Press the attack against the city and destroy it.’ Say this to encourage Joab.”

“When Uriah’s wife heard that her husband was dead, she mourned for him. After the time of mourning was over, David had her brought to his house, and she became his wife and bore him a son. But the thing David had done displeased the Lord.” (2nd Samuel 11:2-27)

What does the displeased Lord do with David?

“This is what the Lord says: ‘Out of your own household I am going to bring calamity on you. Before your very eyes, I will take your wives and give them to one who is close to you, and he will sleep with your wives in broad daylight. You did it in secret, but I will do this thing in broad daylight before all Israel.’”

“Then David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” “Nathan replied, “The Lord has taken away your sin. You are not going to die. But because by doing this you have shown utter contempt for the Lord, the son born to you will die.” “After Nathan had gone home, the Lord struck the child that Uriah’s wife had borne to David, and he became ill. David pleaded with God for the child. He fasted and spent the nights lying in sackcloth on the ground. The elders of his household stood beside him to get him up from the ground, but he refused, and he would not eat any food with them.” On the seventh day, the child died.”

David’s attendants were afraid to tell him that the child was dead, for they thought, “While the child was still living, he wouldn’t listen to us when we spoke to him”. How can we now tell him the child is dead? He may do something desperate.” David noticed that his attendants were whispering among themselves, and he realized the child was dead. “Is the child dead?” he asked.” “Yes,” they replied, “He is dead.”

“Then David got up from the ground. After he had washed, put on lotions, and changed his clothes, he went into the house of the Lord and worshiped. Then he went to his own house, and at his request, they served him food, and he ate.His attendants asked him, “Why are you acting this way? While the child was alive, you fasted and wept, but now that the child is dead, you get up and eat!”

He answered, “While the child was still alive, I fasted and wept. I thought, ‘Who knows? The Lord may be gracious to me and let the child live.’ But now that he is dead, why should I go on fasting? Can I bring him back again? I will go to him, but he will not return to me.” “Then David comforted his wife Bathsheba, and he went to her and made love to her. She gave birth to a son, and they named him Solomon. The Lord loved him; and because the Lord loved him, he sent word through Nathan the prophet to name him Jedidiah.” (2 Samuel 12:11-25)

Prima Qur’an Comments:

So the Lord (Jesus The Son, The Father, and that third wheel, aka- The Holy Spirit) was displeased with David’s actions. So what do they ultimately do? What do THEY DO to David?

  1. They kill David’s infant son! Imagine David saying to his son: “Sorry, son but Daddy got into a fling with some other dudes wife and now well lil tyke you’re going to have die for that!”
  2. They make a decree that David will have his wives taken from him and made to commit adultery in broad daylight. God of the Bible via Prophet Nathan: “What you did displeased me. You know I don’t like it when people commit adultery. To prove my point I am going to decree to have your wives go and commit adultery in broad daylight just to show you how much I dislike adultery!”
  3. Lastly, they reward David with a son through the wife who cheated on her husband and gave her Solomon who in return became a King of Israel and a Prophet! God of the Bible via Prophet Nathan: “David what you did was very bad and even though I killed your son who did not have anything do with your sexual proprietaries but that is water under the bridge, lesson learned. Thus, I am going give you another son through the same women that cheated on her husband.”

What in the Cinnamon Toast Crunch kind of justice is this?!

Notice the above text states:

I will take your wives and give them to one who is close to you, and he will sleep with your wives.”

Such a notable threat, but we don’t hear anything of that kind. The text says that I will take your wives and take them to one who is close to David, and he will sleep with your wives. Which begs the question. How certain can we be that this child that Bathsheba had with David was his child at all?

We have no idea how much time has passed since the death of Uriah and although the text goes out of its way to make it seem that he never had intimacy with her for some time, we can’t be entirely certain. Not only that, but apparently, according to the threats issued by the God of the Bible to David that he would take his wives and give them to someone who will commit adultery with them, how certain can we be that this individual is not the father?

Anyway, this is the depiction of the deity of the Bible and the “justice” of that deity. There is absolutely no justification to think that the passage of the (Qur’an 38:20-26) had anything to do with that, at all!

Not only this but the above text is in major contradiction with the above.

“But the children of the murderers he did not execute, according to what is written in the Book of the Law of Moses, in which the Lord commanded, saying, “Fathers shall not be put to death for their children, nor shall children be put to death for their fathers; but a person shall be put to death for his own sin.” (2 Kings 14:6)

Note that the children of the murderers were not executed. But the above text has:

You are not going to die. But because by doing this you have shown utter contempt for the Lord, the son born to you will die.”

Shaykh Dr. Khalan Al Kharousi (H) has an explanation for this. All praise be to Allah (swt).

Dr. Khalan Al Kharousi (h) mentions a very important point. That here and there a particular mufassir (exegete) would look at the Qur’an through the lens of the Israʼiliyyat material. Which brings us that unfortunate bit about Uriah and David. The text of the Qur’an is far, far from this.

Now that is the explanation given by Shaykh Dr. Khalan (h).

There is another explanation given by our teacher, Shaykh Dawud Bu-Sinani (h) of Algeria.

Shaykh Dawud’s explanation is very straight forward. He focuses on the following text:

  1. So judge between us with truth—do not go beyond it and guide us to the right way.
  2. David’s ruling was: He has definitely wronged you in demanding to add your sheep to his.
  3. Then David realized that We had tested him so he asked for his Lord’s forgiveness, fell down in prostration, and turned in repentance
  4. We have surely made you an authority in the land, so judge between people with truth. And do not follow whims or they will lead you astray from Allah’s Way

So the straight forward explanation given by Shaykh Dawud Bu-Sinani of Algeria is that the hakim should hear both sides of the story. David (as) upon hearing that one brother had the bulk of the sheep, gave in to his whims and was hasty in coming to a decision. However, he immediately realized this. As if he was going to turn to the second brother and say (now you speak) but by than David (as) already showed himself not to be impartial. Thus, David (as) was quick to turn in repentance to Allah (swt).

For those of you who understand Arabic, do not miss out on this gem of the Ummah, Shaykh Dawud Bu-Sinani (h). Ustadh Nouman Ali Khan attended his lecture series in Oman.

Here is a 7 hour Qur’anic course contains seven chapters dealing with the foundations of faith and the practical rules that a Muslim should follow in order to meet his Lord with a blank page free from the traces of sins and sins!

May Allah (swt) forgive the Ummah!

May Allah (swt) guide the Ummah!

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Letter (e-mail) to Professor Todd Lawson on Qur’an 4:157

“And for their saying, “Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.” And they did not kill him nor did they impale (ṣalabūhu) him; (وَمَا قَتَلُوهُ وَمَا صَلَبُوهُ وَلَٰكِنْ شُبِّهَ لَهُمْ)but it was made to appear to them so. Those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no certain knowledge of it, but only follow conjecture. For certainly, they did not kill him.”  (Qur’an 4:157)

This is a recent e-mail sent to Todd Lawson an Emeritus Professor of Islamic thought at the University of Toronto.

For those unfamiliar. Professor Todd Lawson his cv-curriculum vitae can be found here: https://discover.research.utoronto.ca/27086-todd-lawson

I sent this inquiry as I am genuinely curious as to why he or anyone for that matter think that the Qur’an 4:157 seem to be interacting with anything that the Romans have done, or that the text is talking about a historical event known as the “Crucifixion” or that the Qur’an is denying/or affirming anything about a Cross at all.

Greetings Professor Lawson

I hope this email finds you in the best of health. 

I had read your book “The Crucifixion and the Qur’an: A Study in the HIstory of Muslim Thought.”

It was certainly an interesting read. 

You have noted how extraneous material has influenced the Sunni Tafsir tradition and popular interpretation of Qur’an 4:157. 

So to this point I am curious as to why you think the Qur’an engaged with an historical event popularly known as “The Crucifixion” at all?

The reason I ask this is because when one looks at the immediate text of the Qur’an 4:157 there does not seem to be any mention of Romans or Roman involvement at all.

I am deeply interested why your good self or anyone would feel that the Qur’an 4:157 engages with an historical event popularly known as “The Crucifixion” at all. I believe that a reading of the text without extraneous material tells us that the text is interacting with certain Jews who were making certain claims about Jesus. 

When we read Qur’an 4:155 for example:

“They have incurred Allah’s wrath for their breaking the covenant, and their rejection of the signs of Allah and for slaying Prophets without right, and for saying: ‘Our hearts are wrapped up in covers-even though in fact Allah has sealed their hearts because of their unbelief, so that they scarcely believe.” 

I believe we both concur that it would seem out of place for that text to address the Romans of the time of Jesus.

Furthermore the Qur’an 4:157 has a double denial in the text. They did not kill him nor did they (salabu). The initial denial is general and it can easily accommodate any understanding of a possible demise of Jesus. 

It is immensely curious to follow up a general denial that can accommodate any particular understanding of any possible demise of Jesus with a particular denial immediately after. 

Is it not more sensible in keeping with the immediate text and surrounding text to see this as the Qur’an interacting with particular claims made by Jews about Jesus?  Rather these claims are based upon any historical event, document or even oral transmissions in certain circles that the Qur’an would be familiar with?

Given that this seems to be the very obvious case, how do you propose somehow Romans, and a “Crucifixion” is posited upon the text of Qur’an 4:157?

It is peculiar because Jews do not crucify people in their law. It is not a part of the Torah nor of the Talmud of which I am sure you are aware. 

They do have laws about killing people and then impailing them. They do have assertions about those impaled being cursed by God. 

Equally curious is the idea that (salabu) would translate to a Latin Cross, or the Tau Cross. 

Given that the Qur’an in  (7:124); 20:71; & 26:49) all describe cutting off the hands and the feet and given what we know about supporting the body weight on an ecclesiastical “Cross” it is it not presumptuous of us to assume Latin Cross, Tau etc? 

The two noun forms in Qur’an 86:7 & Qur’an 4:23 which relate to the loins and the lumbus region seem to forcefully argue with a type of punishment that would involve impalement rather than anything to do with being tied to a patibulum and affixed to a crux or stake and than having nails driven in ones hands and feet.

When we look at the text of Qur’an 5:33 on page 31 of your book you state:

“the criminal was killed by a separate means before their corpse was publicly displayed on a pike or cross.”   

This does not seem to correlate to what Christians have in mind when they invoke the “Crucifixion” of Jesus. They seem to think this is a death on a cross and not a death prior to a cross. 

 I also felt that pike was more appropriate than cross given what we know about the Islamic legal schools. None of the legal schools, Ibadi, Zaydi, Zahiri, Shafi’i, Imami, Maliki, Hanafi or Hanbali make it a requirement to put someone on a patibulum and affix that patibulum to a crux or stake and than proceed to drive nails in the hands and feet.

Much more can be said. Again I believe my initial inquiry is that if we do a plain reading of Qur’an 4:157 or even invoke the immediate context where are we drawing upon the idea that this is interacting with something the Romans are said to have done to Jesus? 

Thank you for your time. 

Have a blessed weekend ahead.

If you would like to read more on this subject I invite you to read the following:

May Allah Guide the Ummah.

May Allah Forgive the Ummah.

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The Anthropomorphic God of the Bible.

“There is nothing like unto Him, and He is the Hearing, the Seeing.” (Qur’an 42:11)

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You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.” (Exodus 20:4)

So rather than making an image of God, the command goes far beyond that. Christians should not make idols of anything.

“You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.” (Deuteronomy 5:8)

The irony is that this text has been a source of controversy among Christians as if God did not provide clarity for them. So they say, well God says do not make an idol. So their argument goes like this: “We can make the likeness of living created beings, but we just cannot worship them, and thus they are not idols.”

From left to right: Credit to Mart Production and Varan Nm. All photos taken from pexels.com

When it comes to the Bible, both the TNCH and the New Testament are replete with Anthropomorphic descriptions of God.

This is by no means an exhaustive list.

God rides upon a cherubim (usually depicted in art as a naked baby angel)

He mounted the cherubim and flew; he soared on the wings of the wind.” (Psalm 18:10)

God’s thigh and his self promotional tattoo?!

“On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords.” (Revelation 19:16)

How anyone writes created words on the uncreated God merits pensive reflection.

Not only this but usually human females get tattoos in provocative places to draw attention to their assets.

Who has time to focus on a thigh tattoo when there are flashing dazzling lights shooting out from the groin area!

The God of the Bible has loins.

“”And I saw as the colour of amber, as the appearance of fire round about within it, from the appearance of his loins even upward, and from the appearance of his loins even downward, I saw as it were the appearance of fire, and it had brightness round about.” (Ezekiel 1:27)

God’s feet?

“And saw the God of Israel. Under his feet was something like a pavement made of lapis lazuli, as bright blue as the sky.” (Exodus 24:10)

The nostrils of God?

“Smoke went up from his nostrils..” (Psalms 18:8)

God has one ear (not more).

“Give EAR, our God, and hear; open your eyes and see the desolation of the city that bears your Name.” (Daniel 9:18) An Ear, not ears..

Or God has ears (plural)

“In my distress I called to the LORD; I called out to my God. From his temple he heard my voice; my cry came to his ears.” (2 Samuel 22:7)

The God of the Bible has a shadow.

“He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High Will abide in the shadow of the Almighty.” (Psalm 91:1)

How a God that is supposed to be light has a shadow is certainly a mystery!

The God of the Bible whistles?

“At that time the Lord will whistle for the Egyptians.” (Isaiah 7:18)

The God of the Bible gets jealous?

“For I the Lord your God am a jealous God.” (Daniel 5:9)

The God of the Bible smears poo poo (dung) on people’s faces.

“Because of you I will rebuke your descendants; I will smear on your faces the dung from your festival sacrifices, and you will be carried off with it.” (Malachi 2:3)

The God of the Bible emits a sound and walks.

“Then the man and his wife heard the sound of the Lord God as he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and they hid from the Lord God among the trees of the garden.” (Genesis 3:8)

The God of the Bible breaths.

“And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.” (Genesis 2:7)

God has thoughts and people have thoughts.

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts.” (Isaiah 55:8)

So do we deny that God has thoughts because people have thoughts or are his thoughts not like our thoughts?

Do we affirm without asking how or is the how known?

The backside of God?!!

“And I will take away mine hand, and you shall see my backside: but my face shall not be seen.” (Exodus 33:23)

God only needs one digit (a single finger to write)

“And when He (God) had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.” (Exodus 31:18)

God has an unknowable number of fingers.

“When I consider you heavens, the work of your fingers, The moon and the stars, which you have ordained.” (Psalm 8:3)

The God of the Bible has hands (plural).

“The sea is his, for he made it, and his hands formed the dry land.” (Psalm 95:5)

“So I reflected on all this and concluded that the righteous and the wise and what they do are in God’s hands, but no one knows whether love or hate awaits them.” (Ecclesiastes 9:1 )

The God of the Bible has a right hand and Jesus is sitting next to it.

“He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.” (Hebrews 1:3)

The God of the Bible has a right hand and Jesus is standing next to it.

“But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked up to heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God “Look,” he said, “I see heaven open and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.” (Acts 7:55-56)

*NOTE* NO WHERE DOES THE BIBLE SAY GOD HAS A LEFT HAND!

Now obviously, I do not follow Salafiyya/Athari creed. However, those Christians who think they have landed some points against them have erred tremendously.

All that Daniel Haqiqatjou, Mohamed Hijab, Uthman Ibn Faruq, The Muslim Lantern (Chainless Slave) Muhammed Ali, Jake The Muslim Metaphysician, Farid Al Bahraini, or Bassam Zawadi-all that they have to do is ask the following to the Christians.

  1. Does the Bible assert hands for God? Answer: Yes.
  2. Does the Bible assert a right hand for God? Answer: Yes.
  3. Does the Bible assert a left hand for God? Answer: No.
  4. If the Bible does not assert a left hand for God how can you NOT assert that both his hands are right?

Game over! Those Christians would be cooked.

For the Bible says:

“Trust in the LORD with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding.” (Proverbs 3:5)

God of the Bible finds the aroma of charred dead animal flesh soothing and sweet.

The God of the Bible smells (Not what the Rock is cooking but still…)

“Then Noah built an altar to the Lord and took of every clean animal, and of every clean bird, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.  And the Lord smelled a soothing aroma.” (Genesis 8:20-21)

Other translations say: ‘a sweet savour’. “And the Lord smelled a sweet savour”.

God of the Bible repents from his own evil.

“And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.” (Exodus 32:14)

Like this God was thinking of doing something so nasty and cruel to humans and than thought , “Naah that’s a bit too much!”

God of the Bible regrets that he creates his own creation.

“The LORD regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled.” (Genesis 6:6)

God of the Bible can cancel out his own knowledge.

“For I will be merciful to their iniquities, And I will remember their sins no more.(Hebrews 8:12)

The God of the Bible has wings and feathers.

“He shall cover you with His feathers, and under His wings you will trust” (Psalm 91:4).

The God of the Bible mounts, swoops and spreads out his wings.

“Behold, He will mount up and swoop like an eagle and spread out His wings against Bozrah; and the hearts of the mighty men of Edom in that day will be like the heart of a woman in labor.” (Jeremiah 49:22)

God of the Bible sends delusions on people so they believe what is false.

“For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false.” (2 Thessalonians 2:11)

The God of the Bible shaves people’s head, legs, and removes the beard.

“In that day the Lord will shave with a razor, hired from regions beyond the Euphrates (that is, with the king of Assyria), the head and the hair of the legs; and it will also remove the beard.” (Isaiah 7:20)

Some Christian commentators make matters worse by saying this is a full hair removal; for total purity as mentioned in the following text:

“The one to be cleansed shall then wash his clothes and shave off all his hair and bathe in water and be clean. Now afterward, he may enter the camp, but he shall stay outside his tent for seven days.” (Leviticus 14:8)

Thus, and we seek refuge in Allah, the Bible is claiming that God will shave all the hair off (pubic hair, you name it!)

The Bible says God is a man of war.

“The Lord is a man of war: the Lord is his name.” (Exodus 15:3)

The God of the Bible sends an evil spirit upon Saul.

“And it came to pass on the morrow, that the evil spirit from God came upon Saul, and he prophesied in the midst of the house: and David played with his hand, as at other times: and there was a javelin in Saul’s hand. ” (1 Samuel 18:10)

The biggest incident of Saul disobeying God in the Bible is because he did not completely genocide everything and he spared some animals.

Which according to the Bible, God inspires Samuel to inform Saul is just as bad as worshipping idols! So this evil spirit that comes from God comes upon Saul and Saul is agitated knowing that God is going to supplant him with David.

Christians claim that God does not want people to be gay. However; this evil spirit inspires Saul to tell David to collect 100 penis skins for him! Does it get more gay?!

By the way think about this narrative. Do you really think that David went around and methodically cut a perfect circle around every man’s Penis and collected a bunch of foreskins in a bag? No! It means he cut off 200 penises put them in some bags and threw them down in the kings court like ‘Yo! Here’s the Penis skins you wanted!’ -which by the way the evil spirit the Bible God sent to Saul inspired him to tell David to do! Does it get more gay than this?!

Speaking of Gay. Unicorns and Rainbows Oh my!

The God of the Bible has strength comparable to a unicorn.

“God brought them out of Egypt; he has as it were the strength of an unicorn.” (Numbers 23:22)

The God of the Bible relies upon a rainbow in order to remember.

Whenever I bring clouds over the earth and the rainbow appears in the clouds,  I will remember my covenant between me and you and all living creatures of every kind. Never again will the waters become a flood to destroy all life.” (Genesis 9:14-15)

God of the Bible feels sorry that the man he appointed to kill babies saved some animals.

Read the following from (1 Samuel 15:3-26)

One day, Samuel told Saul:

The Lord told me to choose you to be king of his people, Israel. Now listen to this message from the Lord:   “When the Israelites were on their way out of Egypt, the nation of Amalek attacked them. I am the Lord All-Powerful, and now I am going to make Amalek pay!  “Go and attack the Amalekites! Destroy them and all their possessions. Don’t have any pity. Kill their men, women, children, and even their babies. Slaughter their cattle, sheep, camels, and donkeys.”  Saul sent messengers who told every town and village to send men to join the army at Telaim. There were 210,000 troops in all, and 10,000 of these were from Judah. Saul organized them, then led them to a valley near one of the towns in Amalek, where they got ready to make a surprise attack. Some Kenites lived nearby, and Saul told them, “Your people were kind to our nation when we left Egypt, and I don’t want you to get killed when I wipe out the Amalekites. So stay away from them.” The Kenites left, and Saul attacked the Amalekites from Havilah to Shur, which is just east of Egypt.  Every Amalekite was killed except King Agag. Saul and his army let Agag live, and they also spared the best sheep and cattle. They didn’t want to destroy anything of value, so they only killed the animals that were worthless or weak.  The Lord told Samuel,  “Saul has stopped obeying me, and I’m sorry that I made him king.” Samuel was angry, and he cried out in prayer to the Lord all night. Early the next morning he went to talk with Saul. Someone told him, “Saul went to Carmel, where he had a monument built so everyone would remember his victory. Then he left for Gilgal.” Samuel finally caught up with Saul, and Saul told him, “I hope the Lord will bless you! I have done what the Lord told me.”  “Then why,” Samuel asked, “do I hear sheep and cattle?”  “The army took them from the Amalekites,” Saul explained. “They kept the best sheep and cattle, so they could sacrifice them to the Lord your God. But we destroyed everything else.”  “Stop!” Samuel said. “Let me tell you what the Lord told me last night.” “All right,” Saul answered. Samuel continued, “You may not think you’re very important, but the Lord chose you to be king, and you are in charge of the tribes of Israel. When the Lord sent you on this mission, he told you to wipe out those worthless Amalekites. Why didn’t you listen to the Lord? Why did you keep the animals and make him angry?” “But I did listen to the Lord!” Saul answered. “He sent me on a mission, and I went. I captured King Agag and destroyed his nation.  All the animals were going to be destroyed anyway. That’s why the army brought the best sheep and cattle to Gilgal as sacrifices to the Lord your God.”  “Tell me,” Samuel said. “Does the Lord really want sacrifices and offerings? No! He doesn’t want your sacrifices. He wants you to obey him.  Rebelling against God or disobeying him because you are proud is just as bad as worshiping idols or asking them for advice. You refused to do what God told you, so God has decided that you can no longer be king.” “I have sinned,” Saul admitted. “I disobeyed both you and the Lord. I was afraid of the army, and I listened to them instead.  Please forgive me and come back with me so I can worship the Lord.” “No!” Samuel replied, “You disobeyed the Lord, and I won’t go back with you. Now the Lord has said that you can’t be king of Israel any longer.”

God of the Bible is the creator of evil.

“I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.” (Isaiah 45:7)

The God of the Bible hates.

“”I have loved you,” says the Lord. But you say, “How have you loved us?” “Is not Esau Jacob ‘s brother?” declares the Lord. “Yet I have loved Jacob but Esau I have hated. I have laid waste his hill country and left his heritage to jackals of the desert.” (Malachi 1:2-3)

(So the God of the Bible is a God of Love and Hate)

(A God of Love, that Hates or A God of Hate that Loves)

The God of the Bible jeers and pokes fun at his creation.

“He who sits in the heavens laughs; the Lord holds them in derision.” (Psalm 2:4)

The God of the Bible laughs.

“but the Lord laughs at the wicked, for he knows their day is coming.” (Psalm 37:13)

The God of the Bible rages. (Maybe not Rage Against The Machine, but …..)

“The LORD is a jealous and vengeful God; the LORD is vengeful and strong in wrath. The LORD is vengeful against his foes; he rages against his enemies.” (Nahum 1:2)

The God of the Bible has a mouth.

“Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.” (Matthew 4:4)

The God of the Bible is meticulous in how his food should be prepared.

“Command the sons of Israel and say to them, ‘You shall be careful to present My offering, My food for My offerings by fire, of a soothing aroma to Me, at their appointed time.” (Numbers 28:2)

The God of the Bible has knowledge which is impeded by distance.

“But the LORD came down to see the city and the tower the people were building.” (Genesis 11:5)

The God of the Bible is affected by a certain type of wine which cheers him up.

“And the vine said unto them, Should I leave my wine, which cheers up God and man, and go to be promoted over the trees?” (Judges 9:13)

The God of the Bible did not stop Jephthah from burning his small daughter if God gave him victory over his enemies.

Then the Spirit of the Lord came on Jephthah. He crossed Gilead and Manasseh, passed through Mizpah of Gilead, and from there he advanced against the Ammonites. And Jephthah made a vow to the Lord: “If you give the Ammonites into my hands, whatever comes out of the door of my house to meet me when I return in triumph from the Ammonites will be the Lord’s, and I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering.” Then Jephthah went over to fight the Ammonites, and the Lord gave them into his hands. He devastated twenty towns from Aroer to the vicinity of Minnith, as far as Abel Keramim. Thus Israel subdued Ammon. When Jephthah returned to his home in Mizpah, who should come out to meet him but his daughter, dancing to the sound of timbrels! She was an only child. Except for her he had neither son nor daughter.  When he saw her, he tore his clothes and cried, “Oh no, my daughter! You have brought me down and I am devastated. I have made a vow to the Lord that I cannot break.” “My father,” she replied, “you have given your word to the Lord. Do to me just as you promised, now that the Lord has avenged you of your enemies, the Ammonites. But grant me this one request,” she said. “Give me two months to roam the hills and weep with my friends, because I will never marry.” “You may go,” He said. And he let her go for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never marry. After the two months, she returned to her father, and he did to her as he had vowed. And she was a virgin. (Judges 11:29-39)

Prima Qur’an Comments: Now there is major major copium from Christians and Jews regarding this.

  1. Copium # 1. They try and put a spin that the sacrifice is to dedicate his daughter to the Lord as a virgin (meaning temple service) and Jephthah bemoaned that due this he would never have any descendants.

Response: and I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering & After the two months, she returned to her father, and he did to her as he had vowed The emphasis on her being a virgin is so she would be an unblemished sacrificed.

2. Copium #2. God commands against sacrificing Children in the Bible.

Response. No, no he doesn’t!

“You shall not give any of your offspring to offer them to Molech, nor shall you profane the name of your God; I am the Lord.” (Leviticus 18:21)

“I will also set My face against that man and will cut him off from among his people, because he has given some of his offspring to Molech, so as to defile My sanctuary and to profane My holy name.” (Leviticus 20:3)

“You shall not behave thus toward the Lord your God, for every abominable act which the Lord hates they have done for their gods; for they even burn their sons and daughters in the fire to their gods.” (Deuteronomy 12:31)

As well as the related practice of passing the children through the fire and not consuming them by the fire:

“There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, one who uses divination, one who practices witchcraft, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer.” (Deuteronomy 18:10)

“You shall also say to the sons of Israel: ‘Any man from the sons of Israel or from the aliens sojourning in Israel who gives any of his offspring to Molech, shall surely be put to death; the people of the land shall stone him with stones.” (Leviticus 20:2)

Offering your children up as a burnt offering is not against the Torah teachings of the Jews. Nor was it something unacceptable to God. The offence in question was offering them up to Molech and NOT THE GOD OF ISRAEL!

“For I the Lord your God am a jealous God.” (Daniel 5:9)

There is no issue with offering up children as a holocaust (burnt offering) to God. The issue is doing it to false Gods. Because the God of the Bible is jealous.

Did we forget?

“After these things God tested Abraham and said to him, “Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.” He said, “Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I shall tell you.” (Genesis 22:1-2)

The Bible likens God to a groomer that watches a baby grow up develop breast, “body hair” waiting until she was mature enough for “love” and marry her.

“And I helped you to thrive like a plant in the field. You grew up and became a beautiful jewel. Your breasts became full, and your body hair grew, but you were still naked. And when I passed by again, I saw that you were old enough for love. So I wrapped my cloak around you to cover your nakedness and declared my marriage vows. I made a covenant with you, says the Sovereign LORD, and you became mine.” (Ezekiel 16:7-8)

This passage is basically stating that God married “Israel” and it likens God to a man marrying a very young girl. Notice that no one officiates God’s marriage of course. It is just that God wraps his cloak around her and….”Surprise! You’re my wife!”

However, latter we find out that God gets cheated on. That the ‘wife’ of God became like a prostitute.

“‘But you trusted in your beauty and capitalized on your fame by becoming a prostitute. You offered your sexual favors to every man who passed by so that your beauty became his. You took some of your clothing and made for yourself decorated high places; you engaged in prostitution on them.” (Ezekiel 16:15-16)

Prima Qur’an: I always wondered why many Christian and Jewish men had a very unhealthy relationship and attitude towards women. When The Creator of Heaven and Earth gets cheated on then who is the average man compared to God?

Even some Christian polemist who got cheated on may feel a kindred spirit with God.

Many Christians who were sexually violated as youth have read the above passages with a great deal of discomfort. May Allah (swt) guide them and console them.

Granted we as Muslims are understanding concerning metaphor, allegories and rhetorical devices in literature. The Qur’an itself deploys metaphor, allegory and an array of rhetorical and literary devices.

Yet, some of these passages and text in the Bible are quite concerning.

May Allah (swt) guide the Jews and Christians to the truth.

May Allah (swt) guide the Ummah.

May Allah (swt) forgive the Ummah.

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All articles related to Christianity

“Those to whom we gave the Book know it as they know their children, but a group of them knowingly hide the truth”- Qur’an 2:146

﷽ 

“And when they hear what has been revealed to the Messenger, you see their eyes overflowing with tears because of what they have recognized of the truth. They say, “Our Lord, we have believed, so register us among the witnesses.”(Qur’an 5:83)

Pope John Paul Kissing the Qur’an.

“In the first place amongst these there are the Muslims, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind.” -POPE PAUL VI

Source: (https://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html)

“You are the best nation that ever existed among humanity. You command people to good and prohibit them from evil, and you believe in Allah. Had the People of the Book accepted the faith (Islam), it would certainly have been better for them. Some of them have faith, but most of them are evil doers.” (Qur’an 3:110)

In the future all such articles concerning Christianity will go under the heading Jews and Christians here:

First and foremost any Muslim engaging with Christians should understand that those whom identify as Christians have a wide range of different beliefs. We have seen too often Muslims engage with Christians and assume their beliefs. This is akin to a Christian thinking that an Ayatollah from Iran or a Shaykh from Saudi Arabia speaks on behalf of all Muslims.

For example the Eastern Orthodox Christians do not believe that we bear the sin of Adam rather we bear the consequences of that sin. It is a nuanced position.

Another massive and influential Protestant denomination, the Church of Christ (called Campbellites) by their opponents do not hold that infants are sinless and incapable of making free will decisions to sin.

There are key but major doctrinal differences between Eastern Orthodox and Church of Christ (Campbellites) on this matter as well. With Eastern Orthodox believing original sin corrupts human nature this leads to a deposition towards sin. Whereas the Church of Christ (called Campbellites) They reject original sin altogether, believing that each individual is responsible for their own sins. Adam’s sin affects himself and not future generations.

Not all Christians believe in a Trinity, and those that do have greatly different takes on it, some viewing others as heretical. They do not all agree on the nature of Christ Jesus, rather or not he has one nature, two natures, they do not even agree on a set number of New Testament books. They have New Testament canons that range from 22 books, 27 books and even 35 books!

“And with those who say, We are Christians (nasara), We made a covenant, but they neglected a portion of what they were reminded of, therefore We excited among them enmity and hatred to the day of resurrection; and Allah will inform them of what they did.” (Qur’an 5:14)

The above verse acknowledges that there are whole factions under the umbrella terminology ‘Nasara’ . That these factions clash with one another. Therefore, it is foolhardy to think that the term ‘Nasara’ is a blanket term to refer to all those who call themselves Christians. It can refer to those who were faithful before the breaking of the covenant as well as those who came after.

Some Christians object to certain verses of the Qur’an saying: This is not what we believe. They seem to have forgotten that one person’s orthodoxy is another person’s heterodoxy. This is what the Qur’an acknowledges. There can only be hatred and enmity between those who have sharp and irreconcilable differences among them.

We hope that the students and researchers of comparative religion find the following articles helpful!

GENESIS CHAPTER 3 SEPARATES ISLAM AND CHRISTIAINITY

THE WAY OF LIFE THAT EXISTED BEFORE CHRISTIANITY AND JUDAISM

THE DEATH KNELL OF CHRISTIANITY

THE AMAZING HISTORICITY AND EYEWITNESS TESTIMONY OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH.

ARE CHRISTIANS TRULY ASSURED AND CERTAIN OF THIER SALVATION? CHRISTIANS CANNOT CLAIM THAT THEY ARE IN WALAYAH AL HAQIQAH WITH ALLAH

THE DEGENERATE AND DISGRACED CHRISTIANS WHO ATTACKED ISLAM AND MUSLIMS

SHOULD MUSLIMS DEBATE JEWS AND CHRISTIANS?

THERE IS NO HATE QUITE LIKE CHRISTIAN LOVE

THE PLACE OF MIRACLES IN ISLAM & CHRISTIANITY

THE MISSION OF JESUS: TO WHOM WAS HE SENT?

ARE PROPHETS JESUS & MUHAMMED FORETOLD IN THE OLD TESTAMENT?

https://primaquran.com/2024/01/14/are-prophets-jesus-muhammed-foretold-in-the-old-testament/

AHMAD IN THE NEW TESTAMENT?

THE NATURE OF GOD. THE NATURE OF JESUS. THE VARIOUS TRINITY DOCTRINES. THE ALLEGED DEITY OF CHRIST JESUS.

THE ANTHROPOMORPHIC GOD OF THE BIBLE.

DISMANTLING THE TRINITY: JESUS WAS NEVER THE ONLY SON.

ADOPTIONIST THEOLOGY: HOW DID JESUS BECOME THE SON OF GOD?

IS CHRIST JESUS GOD?

DISHONEST CHRISTIAN CLAIMS THE QUR’AN TEACHES THAT JESUS IS GOD.

TEXT THAT CLEARLY SHOW JESUS IS NOT GOD AND THE BIBLE DOES NOT UNDERSTAND HUMAN REPRODUCTION.

WHY JESUS IS NOT THE NAME OF GOD.

DOES THE QUR’AN INACCURATELY DESCRIBE ‘THE’ TRINITY?

JESUS FORESKIN, BABY TEETH and UMBILICAL CORD: THE MIAPHYSIS and DYOPHYSIS CONTROVERSY.

https://primaquran.com/2024/11/11/jesus-foreskin-baby-teeth-and-umbilical-cord-the-miaphysis-and-dyophysis-controversy/

JESUS THE GOD/MAN ?

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/jesus-the-god-man/

DOES THE BIBLICAL TEXT ASSERT TWO INCARNATIONS?

FORGIVING SINS: DOES THIS MAKE JESUS GOD?

THE LIKNESS OF JESUS IS LIKE ADAM.

CHRISTIAN SCHOLARS DECEIFTUL OVER THE WORD ‘WORSHIP’?

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/05/christians-scholars-deceitful-over-the-word-worship/

SHOULD MUSLIMS STOP USING MARK 13:32 AGAINST CHRISTIANS?

https://primaquran.com/2024/11/21/should-muslims-stop-using-mark-1332-against-christians/

WHAT HAS YOUR GOD DONE FOR YOU?

I DON’T HAVE A RELIGION! I HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH CHRIST! I AM A SON OF GOD!

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/i-dont-have-a-religion-i-have-a-relationship-with-christ-i-am-a-son-of-god/

MUSLIM, CHRISTIAN AND JEWISH CONCEPTS OF THE AFTERLIFE.

THE CHRISTIAN HEAVEN AND ISLAMIC HEAVEN: VIRGINS, VIOLENCE AND COUP D’ETAT!

DOES THE CHRISTIAN HEAVEN HAVE A PLACE FOR WOMEN?

PAUL: THE ANTI CHRIST

THE FALSE PROPHECIES OF JESUS.

A CHRISTIAN DILEMMA: WHY WOULD JESUS BE SILENT ABOUT THE RISE OF ISLAM?

HOW DO CHRISTIANS DEAL WITH THOSE WHOM THE GOSPEL NEVER REACHED?

WOULD THEY DIE FOR A LIE? A POPULAR CHRISTIAN ARGUMENT.

https://primaquran.com/2017/11/09/would-they-die-for-a-lie-a-popular-christian-argument/

CHRISTIAN EVANGELIST ADMITS ALLAH IS GOD

https://primaquran.com/2018/05/05/christian-evangelist-admits-allah-is-god/

ALL ARITCLES ON RATHER OR NOT THE BIBLE IS THE AUTHENTIC WORD OF GOD.

THE SO CALLED ISLAMIC DILEMMA: LET THE PEOPLE OF THE GOSPEL JUDGE. WHERE IS THE INJEEL?

WHY IS THE INJEEL FROM GREEK?

IS THE BIBLE THE (UNADULTERATED) WORD OF GOD?

THE QUR’AN CHARGES ORAL CORRUPTION OF THE PREVIOUS REVELATIONS.

DOES THE QUR’AN TEACH THAT THE BIBLE WAS CORRUPTED?

NOTHING CAN CHANGE THE WORDS OF ALLAH.

BETWEEN THE HANDS OR HAVING AUTHORITY OVER (MA BAYNA YADAYHI)

KNOWING OUR THEOLOGY: THE ENCOUNTER BETWEEN HABIB ALI AL JIFRI AND MIROSLAV VOLF

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/05/knowing-our-theology-the-encounter-between-habib-ali-al-jifri-and-miroslav-volf/

A MESSAGE TO JEHOVAH WITNESSSES.

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/a-message-to-jehovah-witnesses/

BIBLE COMMANDS CHRISTIANS TO PAY JIZYAH TAX

THE THIRD COMING OF JESUS?

GENERAL CHRISTIAN POLEMIC AGAINST ISLAM ANSWERED

DO JEWS AND CHRISTIANS RANSON MUSLIMS FROM HELLFIRE?

GIVING ANSWER TO CHRISTIAN POLEMICS WHOM DISPARAGE THE CHARACHTER OF THE BLESSED PROPHET (SAW)

https://primaquran.com/2019/08/29/giving-answer-to-christian-polemics-whom-disparage-the-character-of-the-prophet/

CHRISTIAN POLEMIC AGAINST ISLAM BACIRES AND TESTIFIES TO THE VERACITY OF THE QUR’AN!

https://primaquran.com/2024/10/23/christian-polemic-against-islam-backfires/

THE SO CALLED: SATANIC VERSES (QISSA GHARANIQ-THE STORY OF INTERMEDIARY CRANES)

https://primaquran.com/2024/10/26/the-so-called-satanic-verses-qissa-gharaniq-the-story-of-intermediary-cranes/

CLAIMS OF APOCRYPHAL SOURCES IN THE QUR’AN?

THE WISDOM OF THE BLESSED PROPHET (SAW) MARRYING ZAYNAB (RA)

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/the-wisdom-of-the-blessed-prophet-marrying-zaynab/

ALL ARTICLES IN RELATION TO THE SO CALLED CRUCIFIXION AND EVEN IF THE QUR’AN ADDRESSES THE SO CALLED CRUCIFIXION.

THE QUESTION OF THE HISTORICAL CRUCIFIXION AND THE MARTYDOM OF JESUS.

WHY DIDN’T THE DISCIPLES OF JESUS KNOW THIS?

https://primaquran.com/2022/10/04/why-didnt-they-know/

CRUCIFIED OR IMPALED? UNDERSTANDING QUR’AN 4:157

THE JEWS DON’T CRUCIFY PEOPLE. GREAT EXCHANGE WITH RABBI DOV STEIN.

A CHRISTIAN DILEMMA & HOW MIGHT JESUS HAVE DIED?

JESUS WAS NOT CRUCIFIED: THE EVIDENCE WITH DR. ALI ATAIE.

THE NON-CRUCIFIXION VERSE BY DR. LOUAY FATOOHI: A RESPONSE.

THE OLD TESTAMENT’S FRAMEWORK FOR CHILD RAPE: A PROPERTY CRIME AGAINST THE FATHER, REMEDIED BY BRIDE PRICE AND FORCED CHILD MARRIAGE.

ISHMAEL THE SACRIFICE: RESOLVING THE BIBLICAL CONTRADICTIONS THROUGH THE QUR’ANIC NARRATIVE.

JEWS AND CHRISTIANS AS RANSOM FROM THE HELLFIRE. WHY THE IBADI SCHOOL REJECTS THE SUNNI INTERPRETATION.

90% SILENT: WHY THE CHRISTIAN CASE AGAINST MUHAMMED DEPENDS ON A JESUS WHO BARELY SPEAKS.

GENESIS 11, THE QUR’AN, AND THE ANTHROPOLOGY OF LANGUAGE.

MUSLIMS READ GENESIS CHAPTER 6. THE FLOOD OF NOAH.

NO OBJECTIVE CRITERION: WHY 1 KINGS 22 AND 2 KINGS 3 UNDERMINE TRUST IN BIBLICAL PRPOHECY AND THE GOD OF THE BIBLE.

NEVER THE ONLY GOD: HOW THE BIBLE PRESERVES HENOTHEISM AND THE QUR’AN PROTECTS MONOTHEISM.

Future articles Allah-willing.

Is the Holy Spirit God?

Christian Dominionism: The Violent take it by force.

Subordinationism.

Gregory Palamas and his errors on Islam.

May Allah (swt) guide the sincere Christians to Islam. May Allah (swt) guide them so that they may find peace in this life and the life to come. May Allah (swt) guide the sincere Christians to Islam and save them from the punishment of the hellfire.

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Forgiving Sins: Does This Make Jesus God?

“And let them pardon and overlook. Would you not like that Allah should forgive you? And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.” (Quran 24:22)

“Who spend In the cause of Allah during ease and hardship and who restrain anger and who pardon the people – and Allah loves the doers of good.” (Qur’an 3:134)

“And We have not created the heavens and earth and that between them except in truth. And indeed, the Hour is coming; so forgive with gracious forgiveness.” (Qur’an 15:85)

“O you who have believed, indeed, among your wives and your children are enemies to you, so beware of them. But if you pardon and overlook and forgive – then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.” (Qur’an 64:14)

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First let us address a misunderstanding that people have in general with the Muslim view in regard to Allah forgiving sins.

“Those who, upon committing an evil deed or wronging themselves, remember Allah and seek forgiveness for their sins—and who forgives sins except Allah?—and they do not knowingly persist in wrongdoing?” (Qur’an 3:125)

All sins are sins, ultimately sins against Allah. Rather, they are major or minor. One needs to beseech Allah for forgiveness. That being said, there are three types of relational sins.

  1. Sins against yourself. You did injustice to your own self.

And whoever does evil or acts unjustly to his soul, then asks forgiveness of Allah, will find Allah Forgiving, Merciful.” (Qur’an 4:110)

Coupled with this is the psychological torture a sinner puts on themselves thinking that their sins are greater than Allah’s mercy. That Allah (swt) will not forgive them. This is what is meant by forgiving yourself. Allah (swt) says:

“He said, “And who despairs of the mercy of his Lord except for those astray?” (Qur’an 15:56)

“”O my sons! go and enquire about Joseph and his brother, and never give up hope of Allah’s Soothing Mercy: truly no one despairs of Allah’s Soothing Mercy, except those who ungrateful disbelievers.” (Qur’an 12:87)

“Say, “O My servants who have exceeded the limits against their souls! Do not lose hope in Allah’s mercy, for Allah certainly forgives all sins. He is indeed the All-Forgiving, Most Merciful.” (Qur’an 39:53)

2. Sins against another party.

“And We ordained for them therein a life for a life, an eye for an eye, a nose for a nose, an ear for an ear, a tooth for a tooth, and for wounds is legal retribution. But whoever gives up his right as charity, it is an expiation for him. And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed – then it is those who are the wrongdoers.” (Qur’an 5:45)

So, depending upon the nature of the offense, one can simply forgive the offending party. However, the offender still needs to seek forgiveness from Allah. Another example could be that someone stole an apple from our orchard and we caught the thief. We can settle it with the thief. That they return the apple, that they agree to pay for it. That they exchange for another item. That they work to pay for it. Yet that offender still needs to ask Allah (swt) for forgiveness. For other offenses, different measures may be taken. This is to ensure a stable, just and cohesive society that is not overwhelmed by crimes and injustice.

3. Sins against Allah.

This is self-explanatory. Yet, in all these above cases. Sinning against myself, another party (person or group), in all cases one still needs to seek forgiveness from Allah (swt).


Jesus forgiving sins makes him God?

It would be appropriate for a Christian to prove to us that Allah (swt) alone pardons, and overlooks sins.

Who is this which speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?”


Christians tell us that Jesus must be God because he ‘forgave sins’ and that ‘only God’ can forgive sins.

The text that immediately comes to mind is the following:


“But there were certain of the scribes sitting there, and reasoning in their hearts, “Why does this man speak blasphemies? Who can forgive sins but God only?”(Mark 2:7)


“And the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, “Who is this which speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?” (Luke 5:21)


We find it very peculiar that Christians would take the statement of the people who accused Jesus of wrongdoing and then agree with them!

Basically, the Christian logic is that these people were right. However, Jesus was entitled to do such since he is God.

Prima Qur’an comments:

Now here is some food for thought. Notice that the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason with themselves. Notice that there was absolutely no appeal to proofs and evidence.


Christians argue that the scribes and Pharisees are right based upon their reasoning.

Muslims argue that the scribes and Pharisees are wrong based upon their reason.

So then this would raise an obvious question:
Are there any scriptures that the scribes or Pharisees might appeal to that say that God alone forgives sins or do they simply use their own reason?

We have noted that when Christians try to prove that Jesus is God based upon his ability to forgive sins, they always appeal to Mark 2:7 and Luke 5:21

We have also found it very interesting that they tend to stay away from Matthew chapter 9.

Why don’t they use Matthew chapter 9 verse 8 to prove Jesus forgiving sins makes him divine?

Well, because Matthew chapter 9 verse 8 does not help their case.

In fact, it’s’ a proof text that can be argued effectively against that claim!

“And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; “Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven you.”

And, behold, certain of the scribes said within themselves, “This man blasphemes.”

And Jesus knowing how they were reasoning said, “Why do you think evil in your hearts? What is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven you;’ or to say, ‘Arise, and walk?’ But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins, (then said he to the sick of the palsy,) ‘Arise, take up your bed, and go into your house’.”

And he arose and departed to his house. But when the multitudes saw it, they marveled, and glorified God, which had given such power unto MEN.(Matthew 9:2-8)

*Note* Men plural. Not just a man.

Protestants have suspected that earlier Christians had tampered with the text. So they too have begun to tamper with the text. Notice the various translations of this text into English. Only the New International Version is being blatantly deceptive.

https://biblehub.com/matthew/9-8.htm

But there is something else of importance. You see, all believers do believe that Allah can cause us to be stricken with various ailments and illnesses. This can cause us to be humble, to turn us to the Creator, among other things.

However, apparently there was an understanding among certain of the Jews (if this text were to be believed) that if a person was born with an ailment, handicap or illness that either they or their parents did some sin that warranted this.

“As he went along, he saw a man blind from birth. His disciples asked him, “Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?” “Neither this man nor his parents sinned,” said Jesus, “but this happened so that the works of God might be displayed in him.” (John 9:1-3)


Now let us go back and compare/contrast these three accounts.

“But there was certain of the scribes sitting there, and reasoning in their hearts, ”Why does this man speak blasphemies? Who can forgive sins but God only?” (Mark 2:6-7)

“And the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, Who is this which speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?” (Luke 5:21)

“When the crowd saw this, they were filled with awe; and they praised God, who had given such authority to men.” (Matthew 9:8)

Prima Qur’an comments:

Mark has it that the Scribes were reasoning that only God can forgive sins.

Luke has it that the Scribes and Pharisees were reasoning that only God can forgive sins.

Matthew does not tell us what the scribes or Pharisees were reasoning at all. Rather, Matthew records the reaction of the crowd who praised God for giving such authority to men (plural).

Is there a contradiction? Not necessarily. Two transmitters record the reaction of Jesus’ opponents. One transmitter records the reaction of the crowd (which could or could not contain Scribes/Pharisees).

For Protestant Christians will ignorantly quote the citations of Mark and Luke as proof of the divinity of Christ Jesus.

Latin Roman Catholics, Oriental Orthodox, and Eastern Orthodox should know better. In this situation, the citation of Matthew 9:8 helps to establish authority for men to forgive sins.

We would like to bring the following text to your attention:

“Whosoever sins you remit, they are remitted unto them; and whosoever sins you retain, they are retained.” (John 20:23)

No one is making an argument that these men are divine because they have the ability to forgive and retain sins. The above text, which supports Sacerdotalism, has to be one of the most disliked texts in the entire New Testament by Protestant Christians.

The Most Famous Prayer in Christianity.

“This, then, is how you should pray: ” ‘Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come, let your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us today our daily bread. And forgive us our debts as we also have forgiven our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.” (Matthew 6:9-13)

“He said to them, “When you pray, say: ” ‘Father, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come. Give us each day our daily bread. Forgive us our sins, as we also forgive everyone who sins against us. And lead us not into temptation.’ ” (Luke 11:2-4)

1) Forgive us our debts as we also have forgiven our debtors.

The Greek word there for ‘as‘ is ‘hosper‘ which means: ‘just as‘ and ‘exactly like‘.

2) Forgive us our sins as we forgive those who sinned against us.

Source: https://biblehub.com/greek/5618.htm

Prima Qur’an omments:

Jesus himself taught his followers to ask God to pardon their debts to him exactly like they pardon the debts of others to them. No one is asked to sacrifice their children or animals. Simply to pardon people for their offenses.

So the only way any of us, including Jesus, are ‘divine‘ in that sense would be like the saying,

“To err is human, to forgive, divine.” ― Alexander Pople, An Essay on Criticism

“How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil because God was with him.” (Acts 10:38)

A very powerful example of forgiveness. Forgiveness can be a powerful transformative act for the human soul.

A Muslim man forgives the man who killed his son in a brutal murder. May Allah (swt) grant him paradise and may Allah (swt) open the heart of the other man to the message of Islam.

Muslim woman forgives the man who killed her son in a brutal murder. May Allah (swt) grant her paradise and may Allah (swt) open the heart of the other man to the message of Islam.

It is these conservative Muslim Americans that are transforming their neighborhoods, communities and societies for the better.

“When they hear what has been revealed to the Messenger, you see their eyes overflowing with tears because of what they have recognized of the truth. They say, “Our Lord, we have believed, so register us among the witnesses.”(Qur’an 5:83)

You may Allah be interested in reading:

May Allah guide the sincere among the Christians so that they do not enter the hellfire.

May Allah Guide the Ummah.

May Allah Forgive the Ummah.

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